Are you saying that in the HC a rape victim will be expelled?
That is what the fuse was about, that a woman was raped and turned into the HC for âviolating the rulesâ⌠Known fact⌠they investigate the woman for HC violation, instead of trying to help her deal with the ordeal.
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She was turned in to the HC because the law enforcement could not see evidence of rape. She was also someplace she should not have been when the so called rape took place.
I donât know any specifics, do you? Seems like maybe there were two issues going on simultaneously. A major HC violation and the rape. Why would the HC get involved with a legal issue? Seems like that should and was handled by the police, was it not? I wouldnât want the HC people handling any legal issue. They are there for handling moral and BYU rules. Right?
Ya, I would suspect something wasnât kosher. I donât think though the police turned it over to anyone. Itâs just the HC did their job.
Not sure what you are talking about MikeâŚ
But the person I was talking:
- she was raped by a man she invited into her off-campus apartment in September of 2015. She says she never invited him into her bedroom (a no-no in the Honor Code) - where he raped her.
- Police documents say the alleged rapist later admitted to Madi, over the phone, that he raped her.
- She reported to the Utah County Sheriff department
- The perp was found and arrested and charged with 1st degree felony
- He is currently awaiting Trial.
- A Sheriffâs deputy turned over her police report, including the details of her rape kit to the Honor Code office. He states his intention was to help her prove she was a victim that should not be investigated by the HC. (Some questions about the Sheriffâs motives).
- Federal complaint against BYUâs Title XI office claiming the school handled her case inappropriately.
- BYU reviews HC policies concerning Rape and make adjustments.
So I am not sure why you said what you did, but this woman was victimized and re-victimized by the HC office, which led to changes in their policies.
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please see my comments to this women case⌠There was some weird things that happened, but because of it the BOT made changes to BYU HC policies.
What changes?
A law enforcement officer gave their findings to HC. That was against their policy. Why did they do it? Way different now than the article I read when it first happened. Will we ever know the truth?
Kevin,
Kevin,
I agree with you. The GAâs has stated, that they are open for the Spirit to come in and guide them in all things pertaining to the Gospel. Those decisions that the Spirit is present, are inspired by the Spirit.
Not all decisions made have had the benefit of having the Spirit present. Those decisions were made without the benefit of the Spirit.
Bad wording on my part, but the message is correct.
If I was in control, which I am not and I never will be, my message to my congragation would be this:
Judge not, lest ye be judged, and leave all the judging to God.
Next, I would suggest that we take the doctrine and live it to itâs fullest. Share it with those that want to
hear it and learn from it. But never try force our beliefs onto others that donât believe it and do not want to believe
in it.
Stay true to our beliefs that marriage is between one man and one woman and live by that for ourselves, but never try to stop others that believe differently from doing what they so desperately want to do. We should tend to our own sheep and when not invited, stay out of our neighbors yard and stay out of their business and lifestyle. The Lord demands us to Judge Not, Lest we be judged, and t leave all judging to God. We just donât get it.!!!
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Mike,
Among our group, Liberalism is a nasty word, but I am probably among the most Liberal of the group.
I will never be speaking for the majority, but my thoughts are loving, kind, and good for all people on this earth be they black, white, Asian, Islanders, Latinos, or Indians and all others that I may have left out;
My best wishes are for those from all religions or with no religion. My love and my support are for all straights and L/G.
I beleive that religion, when doing the best it can, is all inclusive of all of Godâs Creations and we should not be finding fault with any of Godâs work. And especially when we do not have all the answers, we should be very careful to judge not lest we be judged and to leave all the judging to God.
There are so many commandments that we should be very careful that we do not pick and choose those that we want to follow and those that we do not want to follow.
The ten commandments, I have not ever completely mastered yet. My efforts are to better myself in that direction and allow God to do his job of doing all the judging on what others are or are not doing⌠Among the most rightous among us, I still see places like humillity, where improvement is needed, but I am not the judge, and I went way to far in even mentioning that. It is not my job to judge, andâI thank God for that.
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Grasshopper,
With real respect for you, I do sometimes differ in opinion.
We are not talking about 600 to 1500 LGBT that may be on a campus of almost 30,000. We are talking about a nation wide if not world wide response to what they call injust bigotry and bias against their community. In another issue, we have the FBI investigating us. Bad press hurts us a lot, but the bad press is not as bad as the harm we create for others and for ourselves by not just living our own values to the fullest without giving credit to others that think differently from us to have their own values, which we do not understand.
The Lord tells us that we are not to judge others, yet we continue to justify our actions as we are non stop judgemental of others. This attitude must stop, or instead of growing as a Church we will see ourselves declining and with more hate from the others that we have offended by not keeping the Lords commandment of Judge not,lest ye be judged and leave ALL the judging to God.
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It is best not to judge others. And I agree. But ignoring commandments, specific ones, and not teaching them to others so they donât make the same mistakes or beable to repent of them to me is not love. Itâs self-righteousness. We can live the sinner and give him the way out. We have had a person in here that says heâs 100% non- attracted to women, except for some reason his wife. Other than that, he said heâs 100% attracted to men. Thatâs not how bisexuals are. So, I believe it is possible for homosexuals to seek out that one person God has prepared for them. Or, stay celibate. Just as the Brethren teach. To me, to teach to love the Lord first and to obey his commandments comes before supporting gay marriage.
I am so sick and tired of the BS I have seen on this thread and the other thread. We are certainly not to judge people in terms of their worthwhileness as children of God. We are to judge the opinions, policies, procedures and actions of others and the institutions they establish. Why have a church at all if this is false? There is no need to have a church at all. There is no need to have any church or established set of beliefs. Why have a church which has such a charge unto itself to go out into the world and preach the gospel and convert as many people as possible to the church if we are NOT to judge the opinions, policies, procedures and actions of others. I hear a lot of the same things on these threads that I read in the Bible about what the Sadduceeâs and Pharisees, who opposed Jesus and the prophets, had to say, finely parsing their words to make the prophets and Jesus seem out of touch with manâs âgospel.â If the First Presidency, the Quorum of Twelve and the other GAs direct the church to action in which âthe worldâ objects so be it. And if âthe worldâ punishes us by not letting us into the Big 12 - SO BE IT. If the LDS Church is the true church of the Savior and if the prophets, seers and revelators are truly directed of God, we will either get into the Big 12 or not according to Godâs will. ARE WE REALLY going to petition these men to, in turn, petition Heavenly Father to change doctrine or policies to make âthe worldâ like us and let us into the Big 12. REALLY? And for all those who rail about keeping the doctrine but change the policy to fit âthe world,â letâs see YOU do that on a PRACTICAL âwhere the rubber meets the road,â and please the Lord and âthe world,â AT THE SAME TIME - I double dog dare you. I realize the sample size here is small but if some of these sentiments are representative of the Church in general, then we may well be seeing a decline in the Church of my youth. I hope not but ???
No unclean thing can enter the presence of the Father. It isnât my words that condemns those who break that commandment. But, in fact, what you are actually doing is suggesting that God didnât know homosexuality was genetic. That our scientists are more intelligent than God. That our politicians are more intelligent than God. Our bleeding heart liberals and Democrats are more intelligent than God. That our members who are stuck on this âloveâ concept at the expense of warning our neighborâs about keeping the commandments are more intelligent than God.
What, life isnât fair? When did you finally figure that one out? No itâs not fair. We are here to learn to control our bodies, parts and passions and keep them in the bounds the Lord has set.
We arenât more intelligent than God. We are subject to God. We are to love him and keep his commandments.
With that said, be a friend to sinners as long as you donât get sucked down their hole with them. Thatâs with all sinners both heterosexual and homosexual. Defend the Kingdom of God, not succumb to the FBI. What a load of crap to fear them. Fear God. If God wants to change a commandment he can. We canât.
Absolutely agree! The brethren are bending over backwards as it is. And, I believe it was prophecizes that there would be a great divide in the Church just prior to the Second Coming. It may be happening. We have to trust the Lord and stay within the bounds he set.
They changed the way they deal with Sexual assault reports and how the HC handles these reports.
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Wow Roy, going off the reservation are we?
First lets clarify some thingsâŚ
- BYU is an institution own by the churchâŚIT IS NOT part of the gospel of Jesus Christ (outside of the learning part).
- The HC is not based on Gospel doctrine, it was created by President Wilkerson in the 60âs to counter the hippie movement.
3.the Church and Gospel of Jesus Christ is two separate things. According to President Uchtdorf " to be perfectly frank, there have been times when members or leaders in the Church have simply made mistakes." check his conference talk 2013 - Come join-with-us) - NO ONE is asking for the Gospel of Jesus Christ to be changed, people do have the right to ask if POLICIES (which are not commandments) to be reviewed and changed.
There is a really good article I think members of the church should look at http://www.gregtrimble.com/3-types-mormons-last-days/
Not everything is black and white Roy⌠Nothing in the policies at BYU is considered âGospelâ⌠So Maybe you should do as the Savior did when the Phraisees brought the harlot to him to judge âGo thy way and sin no moreâ.
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Hopefully they turn it over to the police to investigate before making their HC decisions.
Sister Dew recently gave a devotional talk at BYU-Idaho about the value of asking questions in the process for acquiring a testimony on a topic or issue. She emphasized the need to go to the right sources for information about your questions. After everything I posted, I finally went to find the latest publications and statements by the Church on the topic and came away with the answers I was after. Sorry the discussion didnât help you but the forum was good for me.
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