Interesting article about BYU and Power 5

Thought some of you would like to see this:


I have always respected your opinions, and like you, I have not always agreed, but I think that about 99% of the time I do agree. When there is a disagreement, I always appreciate the way you present your different opinion with openness to other opinions.

Perhaps both you and I have an advantage of being converts rather having been born in the Church.

I believe that each of us are far more sensitive to the beliefs, customs, and morays, of others, not of our faith.

Perhaps, our own immediate family including, but not limited to our own mother’s and father’s, and all other relatives, have taught us to be more open minded and not so self righteous.

Our families feel as much devoted to their own beliefs and we do to our beliefs.

Around people like this, we must be sensitive to not offend, by telling them that our way, is the only right way, even if it is.
They don’t want to hear it and I have learned the hard way, to not try to force our beliefs, on those that don’t want it.

My parents, My aunt’s and uncles, and all of my cousins are, (when alive), Catholic. By the way, the Catholics also feel that they are the only True Church On The Face of the Earth.

When I joined the Mormon Church, I lost my biological family. The inheritance, which was sizable, when to the step children and I was not recognized as a family member and I got nothing. I have my own Peal of Great Price.

All four of my children have served on missions. I have ( + - ) 29 grandchildren that have already or will when old enough serve on a mission.

My father in law for( 13 years) not 4, but 13 years, was a bishop that started Eastmont Ward In East Los Angeles, Ca. and stayed until he started East Lost Angeles Stake, in Monterey Park, Ca.

One of my Son In Law’s was a bishop in Moreno Valley, Ca. for 4 years. All of my kids went to BYU.

I suspect that all of my grandchildren, that qualify for BYU will attend.

We are all BYU fanatics.

I can not stand to be around self righteous people when there are so many good righteous people like you and my children to be around instead.

Thank you Floyd.

With much respect for you.


I was not born into the Church. My mother and father’s families are Southern Baptists, Lutheran, Methodists, Assembly of Gog, etc. Both my parents families were aghast that my Mother converted to the Church. My dad did not join the church until I was 40 years old. I know well what it means to keep the peace and be polite entails. Even though, I have worked in Utah, most of my colleagues are not members or are disaffected members. I have very good relations with the vast majority of my parent’s families, have had good relationships with co-workers and have been in work related leadership positions. I believe that the evidence would show that I am not close-minded nor self -righteous.

I relate all this simply, and only, to report that the 2 of you are not the only socially superior members of this “board.” I bet there are many of us with equally diverse historical and socially sensitive lives. All my life I have heard, from non-members and those disaffected, that “the mormons” born into the church are narrowminded, self-righteous, arrogant and awful (reading between the lines) people.
That is not my experience, with the born in the Church group. Some individuals, yes. Some on this “board,” yes. To believe such things belies the question, why be associated with the Church and this “board” at all?

Wow Arkie talk about being Moral Superior, and you accuse me of of being that way? “Me think you boast too much!”

I grew up in Utah being a non Mormon until High School, my family was not treated very well be members of the church in our small community in which I lived.

Here is the thing Arkie, Ask Jim Hawks about the term “Utah Mormons” by members of this church who lives OUTSIDE of Utah… It is not a very complimentary term either. Because Utah Mormons seems to be full of themselves, prideful and look down on other people. I did not make this term up, in fact it was not until I served a mission that I even knew the term at all.

Second, the only one on this board who thinks they are morally superior is YOU! I nor do I believe Ron has EVER said or acted that way. I simply called out Scott on a post that was interpreted by Ron as offensive and when Ron reply, Scott did not apologize. What I did is called “was being a friend to Ron” nothing more, nothing less.

Most if not all on this board are good people, difference of opinions, but good people. Even Scott is a good person from what I have gathered and from what Jim says. I do not always agree with Scott nor his way of posting, but that is okay, we live in a free country to believe how we want.

Some of the people on this board I have met in person (usually around a football game). They are all great guys.

You started the downward trend of our post, but injecting “moral superiority” and mocking me because I said I defend my friends… So look in the mirror buddy… and pull the mote out of your own eye before you try to remote the glean in my eye!

At least people know who I am because I use my real name!

Ron, until people understand that their actions causes pain, they will not understand what pain they cause.

I do not think Scott tried to offend you, Sometimes he can be a bit of a pill when he posts, but generally he seems to be a good guy (although a little off with politics :open_mouth: )

The issue I had is that when you made a reference of being offended, he did not realize what he did, instead he turned it back on you. That is why I spoke up! I will stand up for people, especially those who I consider friends.

No one on this earth is perfect, but sometimes I feel that certain members of our faith fails to remember that fact. I use to cause a stir in Priesthood with this statement " Have we as members of the church turned into the Pharisees and Sadducee of Christ time? because sometimes we walk around telling people we have the only true church. Isn’t that what they did?"

My current bishop told me once that I see and feel things most members of the church don’t when it comes to people in our ward. Not sure if that is accurate, but I do seem to be a little sensitive to people being critical of others. maybe that is what he was talking about.

But I do thank you for reaching out and expressing your thoughts. These are trouble times for sure, as the prophets of old has said, in these days the very members of the faith will be tested and some will fall away. I really never thought I would see the day when this would happen, not sure I am prepared enough for the trials, but I will do my best to stay the course.

Ummm…I most certainly did apologize to Ron. And, what is it with the the personal attacks on Utah members? Doesn’t look good trashing on members. People are people and no one is perfect.

I acknowledged that in another post and applauded you for it.

Hey Floyd, you again continue trumpeting your moral and social superiority. “Utah mormons” I have heard that since I was an older adolescent, out of state, and it is patent BS. All I did was say you are not so special after all. Me and plenty other saints, in or out of Utah, are fine upstanding people - not perfect, like you, but living our lives in a decent but imperfect way.

Your defensiveness is legendary.

When I first joined this site, I pretty much enjoyed your posts and agreed with a lot of what you said.
However, I have never liked the superiority folks like you profess.

And Floyd keep your gleam, I wouldn’t touch it with YOUR hands.

Arkie… I won’t waste time, because now I understand you really are not that secure in yourself and have to attack (yes, you are attacking my character) me by twisting the comments…

So have a good day sir, the Lord will judge each of us for even these petty little squabbles… how they hurt people intentionally or not.

It was an enjoyable enterprise, for a short time. Something to do during the pandemic shut in time. I have no quilt or remorse about how HF will judge me about these set-to’s. Don’t let the door hit ya, where the good Lord split ya. :sunglasses:

I once had a physiological teacher at BYU, Richard Allen. He always said the Godhead has a sense of humor because of our knees. I think he will also judge our sense of humor and ability to laugh at ourselves.


Did your Psychology Professor at BYU, Richard Allen, have a good sense of humor?


I am so sorry that I have caused you pain with the rebukes from arkiecoug and grasshopper.

Jesus suffered much pain from the likes of the Pharisees and Sadducee

Some people today are more Christ Like, while others are more Pharisees and Sadducee like.

I must learn that there are indeed Pearls of Wisdom that should not be cast among everyone, but to only those that have the ability to appreciate them.

Indeed, I do appreciate your friendship and support. I would suggest that neither of us should reply to anymore hostility, but appreciate any support and kindness from others.



In California, we stopped calling Home Teachers, (home teachers) sometime between
1-2 years ago, mostly because we no longer go to the homes to teach, unless really inspired to do so. We no longer have planned lessons.

We are now called ministering brothers and ministering sisters. We now go to check on the families to see if they have any specific needs and if all is going well in their lives.

Thanks for asking.


He told the joke. And, yes, he had a great sense of humor and was a fantastic teacher. He wrote many health and exercise books.

I don’t think we stop teaching. I remember back in the 1980’s, we had carbon copy forms that we would ask specific questions to our families we HT and write down their responses. We’d give a copy to the Quorum President. The questions were a mix between ministering needs and are they praying, having FHE and so on. We would also go in and defuse volatile family situations.

I am a big boy and can handle crap from people like Arkie…

I think Scott is generally a good person, but sometimes does not realize when he posts that it could come across as something other than what he meant it to be. That is just being human…

I have had my differences with Scott, but I have never had him pull what Arkie did this last time… Although Arkie does not seem to understand the concept that he crossed the line.

He reminds me of a old poster named Shad, he had the same type of thing going on. Didn’t like it when people challenged his comments. Who knows, with fake names it could be anyone.

Life is about enduring challenges, I have had my share lately, but I doing okay by remembering that I do not have to please everyone in this world…

But thanks for the comments, I look forward to your opinion on things, because I appreciate “Difference”.


We think so much alike. I value your friendship.

I remain so sorry that I got you involved in this, (less than intelligent), type of debate where nobody wins, and we all lose. It is sad that one can not have intelligent differences of opinion without someone being so threatened by the difference that the worst of us comes out for the world, (unfortunately), to see.


Hey, I was willing to let the nose tweaking lie but some folks (2) want to keep jabbing air (meaning your comments have no meaning for me). But y’all gotta do what y’alls characters lead you to do.

Ya, they get mad at you and then they keep it up. Oh well…

Calling BS on this… you started it, you instigated it , and you continued it…

I just called you out on using a fake name… because not using a real name emboldens you to say things you normally won’t.

At least Scott used a moniker, but still showed his name…