Legend passes away

Agreed on all.
I will note that for the last couple years of Rose’s career I was screaming HIRE POPE from the rooftops–it was NOT in any way because I wanted to “get rid of Rose”–it was because I was afraid BYU, out of a sense of well-deserved loyalty to Coach Rose, would wait too long and Pope would be gone forever to a much more high profile job.


BYU currently is hoovering in that 30-40 ranked pre-season slot. My vibe is BYU is better then that. This is a very mature team with Barcello as the team captain. I watched "auto 3"Knell’s defense improve to the point you really can’t keep him off the floor. We know Lohner is going to make a “stars” leap (he started the season missing 8 out of 9 threes, then finish hitting at a 50% clip). George had a 30 point game and was the most athletic player on the court at a BYU-Gonzaga game, so I see him improving and wanting more time. Johnson is just plain stable. Baxter could explode this year…What am I missing?
Pope is a great mix of wanting points out of every possession while urging his guys to really get after it and play freely. I have BYU every bit as good as last year, maybe better. buckle up.

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First let me say that a benefit of COVID restrictions in Oregon is that I can watch a continuing legal education seminar on one screen and type messages about BYU hoops on the other screen :slight_smile:

Guess which is more fun?

Lohner has NBA strength and athleticism. No exaggeration. Very rare recruit for BYU (but will not be so rare moving forward as long as we have Pople). Lohner will have to have a more advanced offensive game to make the jump to The League, and I know Pope is challenging him big time to do that. I think he will be more assertive on offense and that Pope will trust him for more plays to him (last year he played A LOT of garbageman on offense).

Seneca is skinnier than Lohner, but he might have more length and if he has even similar hops, those two are a wicked good pair of wing guys who can also attack the rim WITH FEROCITY.

I am on the Te’jon Train. We can’t help but compare him to BA:
Overall I really really liked BA, but he just couldn’t guard. Big advantage Te’jon.
Te’jon is not a great shooter, but neither was BA. It’s a push.
Te’jon has size and is a GREAT rebounding guard. Advantage Te’jon.
Both were P5 recruits. Push.

I think Te’jon will be not only a significant upgrade, but also a more consistent player–BA was really hot or cold.

One more note:
Neither Te’jon nor Seneca is known as a great outside shooter, but BYU has plenty of guy who can hit 3s but who struggle to slash and score in traffic at the rim. I think these two add an element to our offense that was missing last year.

Had Mika not left early, would Emery had been more under control of his emotions?

It would have been very interesting to have had a stable influence on the court for Emery, but I think he needed a Pope influence off the court. Pope doesn’t put up with selfish behavior. If Rose hadn’t run out of energy and kept a tight lid on the selfish behavior on the court ……. And we all know that as freshman Rose gave too long of a rope to Haws and Emery …… that both Haws and Emery would have matured faster. Mika just plain didn’t feel that he was being coached to become a better player. He was correct! So he left for the pros. If he had a Pope who would tell him the truth about his game and improve Mika at each practice I think Mika would have stayed. Those 3 kids wanted to win a championship so bad that they because disillusioned with the program and to some extent with Rose. Rose loved Emery but the only family who stepped in and kept their kid headed in the right direction was the Haws clan.

Yep huge potential but it never really materialized. Mika had the highest upside and could have played in the NBA if he had refined his skills in college. I can’t blame Rose for recruiting them at all. Just remember the reason that Emery left the program for good …… that was all Pope …… these are the rules and if you can’t live by them then hit the door. Emery decided to leave instead of abide the new code of conduct that Pope laid out.

Hopper that is a thoughtful question and posed in a way that doesn’t light up the room. I am not sure my answer is correct but it’s what I think. Anyway …. good job.

Mika had only good things to say about Rose when he left. He left with class. I heard that Mika just didn’t like school. Maybe he had school burnout. I took a 3 year vacation between my AA degree and starting back up 2 years later. Of course, he got some money shown to him as well.
I heard also Emery deals with some mental issues as well. Some can handle that with maturity and others struggle with it. Some have a real great support group and others don’t. He had great potential.

Reading the newspaper, the reason for Emery emotional state that led to depression was that he went through a horrible divorce and his ex was very vindictive. that is how the ncaa found out about the issue with the BYU booster.

Emery did the right thing and walked away from basketball to get his head on straight.

watching my son go through the same type of divorce, i can say it is not easy for a person to go through and handle.

if Mika had stayed, I think he would have been a good support for Emery.

Interesting reading the discussion here. I have some thoughts about all of it but it would only be repeating the stuff that has been written for the most part. I still detest nepotism and everything associated with it. I believe it has been more detrimental to the overall program than beneficial. I am positive about BYU but I still have lots of reservations about the atmosphere on campus as well as the favoritism and special treatment afforded privileged characters. It is part of the bubble atmosphere that is so prevalent in Utah valley. In that regard I also find it amusing that people (not pointing to anyone specifically) believe the LP3 had a chance to take BYU to the final four or a national championship. :rofl: That was NEVER going to happen but living in a bubble creates lots of delusions for people.

Thanks for the great back and forth (tom, chris and thawk mostly), it was enlightening and entertaining.

JCoug: “. . . LP3 had a chance to take BYU to the final four or a national championship. :rofl: That was NEVER going to happen but living in a bubble creates lots of delusions for people.”

Well happens all over the country to all of the sports teams, pro and college. The hype in football this year was out of this world. All the fabulous and deep talent at each and every position. Have the TEs been utilized more than here and there. We were supposed to have a whole stable of WRs. How many have been targeted beyond 2 or 3. Supposed to have a great stable of RBs. Glad there is one stud there because if Algiers goes down the RBs left won’t do much. I don’t care if next year if the team goes 10 and 0, I will not succumb to the hype. I would be pleasantly surprised but not head over heals punch drunk.

Arkie, you raise a GREAT point about BYU’s weapons this season. Despite the coaches and media telling us this is the greatest and deepest group of wideouts ever at BYU, here is where we are through 8 games, and including a 13th (bowl) game:
Romney: on pace for 39 catches
Puka: on pace for 32
Pau’u: on pace for 60
Samson: on pace for 10
Rex and Holker combined: on pace for 37, basically the same as last year
Katoa: After 3 productive years rushing and receiving, he’s simply not a part of the game plan. In 4 years he has never averaged under 4.2 ypc and has never had fewer than 20 receptions, but he’s just simply not part of the plan this year.

If Roderick doesn’t trust that Hall can get the ball to our obviously extremely talented wideouts, we should be throwing more dink and dunk stuff to the TEs and RBs and save Allgeier some of the pounding…

I think anyone familiar with the program would say that regarding the WRs and RBs in the passing game, ONLY Pau’u is contributing anywhere near his potential. Either A) our coaches are blowing smoke telling us how good these receivers are, or B) Roderick doesn’t trust the QB enough to get them the ball.

I’m going with B.

The biggest problem for the offense is the defense or otherwise TOP. You can’t score without the ball. I’m not sure how many times BYU has had to punt this year, but my gut tells me it’s very low. Problem is they don’t get the ball that much. You could see this again on Saturday night. Virginia is a very ball control passing offense. Who has the ball the longest may equal who wins the game-mark it down

I agree with you on the TE not getting passes. We have gone to a run first game. Against WSU we passed only 20 times mainly to keep the ball moving. Hall was 15-20. With low number of passes, I would expect the receivers to have less passes to them as well. Pau’u seems not to be double teamed as often and with his abilities gets open more often. So, I agree with your numbers.

My take on the game tomorrow: UVA 45 and BYU 23

BYU will play keep the ball away from Virginia. As long as BYU doesn’t turn the ball over -
BYU 31 VA 24

Boom, last year I wrote often about the fact that when TJ Haws left, we no real replacements that could drive and dish. It was not Barcello’s natural move and BA would get in trouble at times when he drove. These two transfers, if they are drivers, and we know Lucas is…will make BYU very tough to guard. Johnson could do it if he had to. Salivating.

No doubt and great point. Mika would be in the NBA had Pope coached him up. Sabonis type game.

Marty taught his kids right. Loyal!!! Emery left the mish. early with a circulation problem (vein was outside the rib cage, had to be re-routed). I see kids leave early for many reasons. When I was out there, we had maybe 1 or 2 leave all mission long. It was unthinkable to leave early, today, any excuse will do. I did go to many practices (and plan on going next week), Emery was horsing around a lot with Rose as the HC, big distraction. Pope keeps his practices going from the moment you step in the gym, these guys haven’t got a second to screw around.
Get there, stretch
run drills
break out, shooting drills
work on plays
Simulate game with blues (starters) vs. whites
hit the showers and some guys stay back to work with coaches one on one or shoot.
At no time is there any freedom to goof off.

Mika did the right thing. Emery was a mess.

They did it in HS, Jim. Took it too all of the farm teams out there that load up on D1 talent. Just sayin’. HS National Champs. And Shumway, that played receiver on the football team was every bit as good as the others at 6’3. Speed to burn. Every one of those guys were 4 star or better players-ESPN top 100, ask Reed Omer. If Emery was more like Jacks, his older brother (who still owns the steals record), BYU would of taken BYU to a final four. Mental is 50% of an athlete’s success. Emery did not have it. Pope would not have played Mika with his back to the rim, as Rose did…he would of run a pic and roll with TJ and the only time Rose ever did it was after I had an NBA coach suggest that as they prepped for the Gonzaga game for all of you that have short memories…and the first time Rose beat Coach Few. DOCUMENTED FACT.

Don’t you agree that when Sitake picks a QB, he sticks with him? Hall was stellar before the ribs. Romney as never lost a BYU game and would get the ball to these NFL receivers. just sayin". Sitake backed the wrong horse.

BYU has dominated TOP in only two games all year: Utah and ASU. Why? Because those are the ONLY two games all year in which BYU used a blitzing, aggressive defensive scheme, forcing 3 and outs and turnovers.

In those two games, our aggressive D created havoc resulting in 6 turnovers (3.0 per game).
Our D has 6 TOs total (1.0 per game) in the 6 games in which we have played Wave the White Flag D.

It’s pretty simple: playing aggressive D, BYU created TOs and beat 2 very good teams that both had far superior athleticism.

Playing passively, BYU has a good win over a decent USU team with inferior talent, barely beat terrible Arizona, barely beat terrible SFU, barely beat average Wazzu, was beaten soundly by a BSU team with equal, and dominated by a Baylor team with far more talent.

Many of us remain mystified why Kalani decided to scrap the winning game plan vs Utah and ASU–easily our two signature wins this year.

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Very hard for any HC to bench a QB who is playing fairly well. Baylor created a problem when he played LIGHTS OUT in two straight games, and far better than the presumptive starter. I don’t want to hear “It was only USU and USF,” because those two are no worse than Arizona and Wazzu. Hall’s advantage is his running, but he’s only averaging 30 yards per game rushing and has taken a few REALLY stupid sacks. Somebody else here posted that if you are gonna play Hall, he has to run, or you should just go with the clearly better passer.