P5 conferences, realignment and expansion

Football
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Let’s remember that ESPN is a big-time FOBYU (friend of BYU). Holmoe is close with the senior programming executives. No matter what happens, I don’t think BYU gets hung out to dry by ESPN. If ESPN drives a major realignment, I think ESPN gives BYU a seat at whatever that table may be, or if we stay Indy ESPN at least guarantees/coordinates matchups with the power programs, just like they do now. Some schools may not like BYU because of the religious affiliation, standards, etc. but ESPN doesn’t care about any of that stuff. They care about $$$ and $$$ alone, and BYU’s national audience delivers for ESPN, year after year.

And the Big12 is screwed if Texas and OU bolt. Wonder how Baylor and KSU and OSU (I think those were the 3–maybe ISU instead of KSU) feel now about preventing BYU from joining a few years ago? HAHAHAHAHA

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That ESPN relationship with BYU has kept BYU in the convo. for the past 10 years… The Covid year and Wilson drafted #2 made for a dream season for BYU. This is the year that BYU makes or breaks an invite. 11 players land in the NFL (for the time being) and ESPN had the balls to say that BYU is favored in 10 games. It’s just crazy to me.
And I just want to shut Utah up!

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And if the Y wins big then we stay in the convo. But if we stink up the joint, we are forgotten has-bens.

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Anyone staying on top of the Big 12 demolition? OK and TX have signed on to the SEC (TV rights owned by ESPN). Big 12 have only two options…add teams like BYU, Cinn, Houstion etc but be down graded from a P5.

Or the big 12 desolves and good teams head to other P5 conferences, the remainders join a G5.

It would be a mistake for BYU to join the Big 12 right now.

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Why would the Big 12 be automatically downgraded?

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BYU Campus, Floyd, Boisey Coug, BYU Campus, dew.
I have read each o fyou postings. I have learned from them. I agree with almost all that each of you say in your posting.

I go back to the start of School year 1953-54 on the Quarter System at the Y. Much has changed in Football since those years. I never missed a game from 1970 forward.

I think that we may need to change our focus just a bit.

  1. Never before now, and not anytime under my favorite coach of all time and all colleges, Lavel Edwards, or Gary Crowton, or BM have we had a more elite consistent football schedule as we have now under KS.
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Boise Coug,

I find your post quite interesting on many different levels and directions.

" Nobody wants us"
We can call this predjudice; unfair; nasty; and look at ourselves as the victim.

Or

We can look at the situation, and ask ourselves, what can we do differently, without compromising our values, that could bring about an improvement with our relationship with other teams?

Example: The coaches at BYU may believe certain things, regarding the players regardless of what team they are on, but they should not lecture to all coaches in general that they need to follow BYU’s lead.
You may or may not hate Nick Saben, Urban Myers, Peterson, and others, but you as a new coach at BYU should not publically tell them that the the players are just kids; they are just playing a game; No coach should ever run up the score on these kids, etc. etc. etc. That kind of coaching arrogance would make most coaches irritated to say the least.

It’s good that we do not play on Sunday, but we should not use that as a weapon or an excuse for not getting into the P5 conferenes.

Our Missionary situation has some advantages and some disadvantages for us, but we should not use that has a weapon or an excuse for not getting into a P5 conference.

Our Honor code is just that. It is honorable and justified.
Iit should not be used as a weapon or an excuse for not getting into a P5 conference.

We should never assume, or say, or act like we have the only honor code system that is worthwhile, valid, or tougher than any other. This makes schools like ND, Boston College, Baylor, TCU, SMU, Liberty or Presbyterian to be not too friendly towards us, and still, we wonder why they are not friendly towards us or we just call it being prejudice on their part.

When we ack like we are always right, and anyone that does not agree with us are wrong or just don’t understand the right way like we do, than that does not make for good relationships.

Our best cop-out" for this is, "I’m not going to compromise my values for anyone. They can take it or leave it. " I’m not trying to please anyone.

Next we set back and say that they are just prejudiced. We never accept any of the responsibility that we sometimes create in a negative way.

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Floyd,

Tell me how Texas TV Contract issues with the rest of the Big 12 and beyond, is much different, (except for the size of the paycheck), then BYUs ESPN Contract.

Yes, I do believe that BYU would give up their ESPN Contract to get into a P5 conference that is stable.
(Not the Big 12). Yes, I believe that Texas would give up their TV Contract to be a member in good standing with the SEC. Nobody doubts that the SEC has built/is building, a conference dynasty. if invited, what power 5 team in the nation, would not like to be a member of the SEC Conference.?

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Or we can look at it as “Nobody wants us” and that’s okay. No victimization, etc. The football situation has worked out well for BYU and most likely will continue to do so.

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in order to keep Texas from bolting the Big12 a few years ago the BIG12 allowed Texas to make their own TV contract and keep all the revenues from the deal.

that is what I was talking about, Texas football is not really UofT team, they are controlled by a corporation that pays royalties to Texas for the use of thier name.

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BYU Canpass

I see three options for BYU

  1. Go G5 or smaller in order to be in a conference. Certainly someone will want us at this level.
    We could be guaranteed a bowl game each year. (NO No No)

  2. Get invited to a P5 Conference (YES YE YES)

  3. Stay independent. (Maybe, Maybe, Maybe

Sometimes I scratch my head when I see posters state that we should go to a G5 conference or Big Sky
so that we would have a greater chance to get a New Years Day Bowl. (Hogwah)

To go with option 1, we might get 1-2 P5 games per year if we are lucky.

We would be giving up playing 7-8-9 P5 teams per year that we could play, so that just maybe if all the stars are lined up correctly and if all other teams are having a bad year, we just might have a chance to play for that big check on New Years Day.

Where is the thought process in all of this?
I remember when playing Rice was a big deal. Air Force had a big name for us.

Why would we even consider going backwards in order for a chance at the Roulette table of just maybe if we are extremely lucky and others are extremely unlucky, that we as a G5 conference team member would get a shot at that New Years Day Bowl. Hey, on New years day, we would probably get a shot at a big P5 team!!! Crazy, Cazy, Crazy!!! As an independent, we get a shot at 7-8- or in the near future, 9 P5 teams each season, almost guaranteed…

Outr AD is doing a fantastic job. He has us on the right course. Sure in the past, we had a NC year. We had a Micacle Bowl year; We had a Heisman year, but never before, have we had the near P schedule that we now have. Never before, have we been more deserving to be invited to be in a P5 conference.

It is my opinion that which we are doing now with our scheduling, will do more to help us get into a P5 conference than anything that we have done in the past.

Yes, Washington will finally melt. it wasn’t our Religion that caused Washing to start the hate against us, instead, it was the relative light schedule that we had winning the NC that Washington thought should have gone to them with their much heavier schedule.

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Boise Cougar,

If I am understanding your post correctly, I think that I agree with you.

"Nobody Wants Us’

FOR ME, FOR MY BELIEFS, FOR MY LIFE STYLE, FOR MY DESIRE TO IMPROVE WHERE POSSIBLE, THIS IS WHAT I WOULD AND WOULD NOT LIKE TO DO: Improve communication; stop boasting.

WHY DOESN’T ANYBODY WANT US?

IS IT MORE LIKELY BECAUSE OF OUR HONOR CODE THAT TEAMS AND/OR CONFERENCES DO NOT WANT US, OR IS IT MORE LIKELY OUR BOSTING ABOUT OUR HONOR CODE BEING TOUGHER THAN ANY OTHER UNIVERSITY: I’m SURE THAT BOSTON COLLEGE, BAYLOR, TCU, SMU, TRINITY, PRESPERTARIAN, Liberty, and ND would take issue with this. We would NOT agree, but still, it is not a pleasant situation to be in.

IS IT MORE LIKELY BECAUSE OF OUR “NO SUNDAY” PLAY, THAT TEAMS, AND/OR CONFERENCES DO NOT WANT US, OR IS IT ABOUT OUR BOASTING ABOUT IT?
MAKING OUR UNIVERSITY THE ONLY ONE THAT KEEPS THE SABBATH HOLY?

IS IT BECAUSE OF OUR MISSIONARY PROGRAM, THAT OTHER TEAMS AND/OR CONFERENCES DO NOT WANT US, OR IS IT THE WAY WE MAKE OURSELVES MORE PERFECT THAN THE OTHER TEAMS IN THE CONFERENCE THAT WE WANT TO BE A PART OF?

IS IT OUR STEADFASTNESS ON RELIGIOUS ISSUES, OR IS IT JUST BECAUSE WE ARE TOO DIFFICULT TO GET ALONG WITH AND WITH TOO MANY DEMANDS.

WITHOUT COMPROMISING OUR BELIEFS AND OUR CONVICTIONS, WE MUST LEARN HOW TO COMMUNICATE BETTER WITH THOSE NOT OF OUR FAITH.

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I WANT TO BE IN A P5 CONFERENCE SO BAD THAT I DREAM ABOUT IT EACH NIGHT.

HOWEVER, I WOULD RATHER STAY INDEPENDENT THAN JOIN THE BIG 12. THE BIG 12, ESPECIally at this time, SOUNDS TOO MUCH LIKE THE BIG EAST.

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Ron, Regarding your dream of having BYU in a P5 Conference, I doubt if BYU’s past or recent on field performance will have much if any effect on the final outcome. This is BUSINESS and chasing MONEY is what drives the outcome. When the dust settles, the fate of BYU will be determined by the bottom line: Will having BYU in their conference be more profitable than NOT having BYU in their conference?
This will be by invitation only! What will influence those in power to issue an invitation or not has MUCH MORE to do with viewership. market share of likely broadcast sponsors, brand recognition, and stadium capacity; in other words, MONEY. I believe we ARE attractive to P5 conferences, but not for the reasons you are suggesting. Playing and winning games against P5 opponents helps with name recognition, larger viewership and fan support, but our ESPN backing and TV market share will be what gets us the invite IF IT DOES COME. GO COUGARS!

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The words “Nobody wants BYU” were first written by a writer for USA Today–I forget his name–back in 2016. At first I was offended; but as time has progressed, I see the phrase as a compliment. Yes, BYU is not enjoying some of the benefits of being P5. But it is still doing well and is not being pressured to compromise its values. Ron, I think you and I do agree.

That said, I too would love P5 membership if only because I hate that the utes have it and the Cougars don’t.

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Well, Ron, I do not want to engage with you but I am tired of your disparaging remarks about BYU, her fans, and LDS Church membership.

I challenge you - yes I CHALLENGE YOU to document your disparagements. Again I challenge you to DOCUMENT what you assert. Documentation is not what people say or think. Documentation is hard and fast evidence. EVIDENCE is not what people say or think.

DOCUMENT THE FOLLOWING:
BOSTING ABOUT OUR HONOR CODE BEING TOUGHER THAN ANY OTHER UNIVERSITY,
OUR BOASTING ABOUT NO SUNDAY PLAY,
THE WAY WE MAKE OURSELVES MORE PERFECT THAN THE OTHER TEAMS IN THE
CONFERENCE THAT WE WANT TO BE A PART OF?
OR IS IT JUST BECAUSE WE ARE TOO DIFFICULT TO GET ALONG WITH AND WITH TOO
MANY DEMANDS,
WE MUST LEARN HOW TO COMMUNICATE BETTER WITH THOSE NOT OF OUR FAITH.

RON, I CHALLENGE YOU TO PROVIDE DOCUMENTATION OF THE ABOVE. :speak_no_evil:

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Right on

Big 12, Pac-12 commissioners to discuss partnership | Yardbarker

Big 12 are in a heap of hurt right now.

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Arkie,
You like to stir the pot and we have had our differences. BUT TO SCREAM AT RON for his comments is not only childish but immature.,

So let’s take your comments one at a time:

If you go through the history of this site, you will find multiple references by posters that the HC is the tougher to than any other university honor code including Notre Dame’s. If you read comments all through any article, the same thing comes out.

What is a FACT (please check BYU admission information) is that BYU has raised it standard academically for all athletes, they HAVE to meet the minimum requirements for admission, then add to that the strict HC policies and that turns off a lot of players. In the old days they use to be able to do what they called “Academic Qualifiers”, not anymore. These players go through a JUCO ranks to bring up their grades then transfer to a University to play.

This come directly from the brethren that we need to better at being more “inclusive” than “exclusive”.
Do you remember the term “The True Church” that for decades members use to spout at other people of other faiths? the condescending tone that some how their church was wrong and we were right. It was really hard to overcome the feelings of these people when I meet them on my mission. We don’t use that term as much these days, we still believe it, but the fact we are trying to include other people in other faiths more, it is not said as much.
Because of these types of comments, non LDS people (and some LDS folks as well) associated the “Holier than thou” attitude of some members with the sports programs at BYU.
Our fans don’t help when they misbehave and say things that are offensive to other religions, Like my favorite “Holier than thou” comment "BYU is the “Lord’s University”.
In this case, there is no “Facts”, just perception and in the “Real World”, “Perception” is reality.

Here is an article that expounds on the “BYU is difficult” comment.
BYU reportedly has some good reasons to be ‘difficult to work with’ - Vanquish The Foe

Some people or conferences may view the “No play on Sunday” stance as being difficult, but that is what the brethren has set in “Concrete” that we will not play on Sunday. The other issue is BYUTV rebroadcast rights, BYU wants to be able to rebroadcast their games as much as possible, to some conferences this might be considered “difficult” as well, but what BYU had to deal with in the MWC might have something to do with that.

Ron has a right to his views and comments, as much as you do… I only ask that you treat Ron with the same respect you want from others. I do not always agree with Scott (Grasshopper) or Chris (Fish) or even Jim Hawks, but I respect their rights to have their opinions.

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From what I’m hearing, I think the SEC is trying to perhaps make a super conference of 32 teams. Then control the money, power and basically a new semi-pro league. I wonder if the try this if the SEC could be guilty of antitrust monopoly laws?

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The all capitals was me cutting and pasting from Ron’s own post - so the screaming was Ron screaming. And you labeling me as childish and immature is your opinion but remember that you are labeling me but I have not labeled. I ONLY asked for Ron to provide evidence / documentation of his general overarching disparaging screaming remarks about BYU / BYU fans / membership of the LDS church. I have requested because he has made these general overarching disparaging remarks many, many times. He has yet to reply.

My problem is the disparaging genralization of BYU, us as fans and the Church membership. I do not like it and I do not care if you or anyone else is unhappy with me or my remarks here. As you say, I am welcome to my opinions as well as Ron is or anyone else is.

Your remarks are not documentation / evidence of the general overarching disparagment of BYU / BYU fans / LDS Church menbership.

If we. the Church / membership deny truth for political purposes then what is the stone cold difference between that and other churches politilization of their churches. Has the modern LDS church become the same kind of church that Joseph Smith had such deep concerns about that he inquired of the Lord in the sacrad grove? Is the current LDS church but one of many, many churches on the face of the planet. Sincere and legitimate questions.

When I only requested Ron himself to provide evidence / documentation, I fail to understand your attack upon me. I am ready for another attack. Have at it.