This game was really bad on so many levels, it's hard to describe

Emery was out of control almost the entire night. Yea, he scored a few points, but in one way or another I believe he must have been responsible for 10+ turnovers and more really horrible plays than anyway should have in a season.

Bryant is worthless to this team as he has very little talent but thinks he’s a pro. He’s a black hole in that once the ball goes to him, no one else sees it again.

Overall defense is absolutely lacking. Not only do the guys play it badly, but it’s a poorly designed defense on top of it that struggles big time with corner shots. But it’s the horrible play that allows for all the drives. Hard to watch.

Lastly, I thought this game was the worst coached game I have seen out of Rose in all his years. Never got the guys calmed down to the point where they were playing with what the refs were giving. Playing Bryant over Guinn is an absolute travesty. Playing that ugly zone as much as he did is a huge mistake. This game is as much on Rose as it was on the players. Not calling a time out with 10 seconds left and getting the best 3 point guys in, but instead putting the ball into Emery’s hand while double teamed, is a huge, huge coaching mistake. Maybe Rose doesn’t know how to draw up a last second three point play, but he’s got to do better than what he showed tonight.

A couple of other thoughts. Refs stunk but they stunk both ways. BYU caused a lot of foul calls with horrible play, period. The team really played out of control for long portions of the game.

Super disappointed with Emery’s performance. Again, Rose needs to take control of this team and sit him for long stretches when he plays so out of control. That’s what coaches get paid for. This team could really use a coach like the one portrait in the movie Hoosiers. I don’t mind going fast, but for heaven sakes, stay under control and play smart.

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Agreed on all points. Especially the zone defense and Bryant getting any minutes at all after his very first shot/turnover. How Coach Rose could sit Guinn and watch what Bryant did is unbelievable to me.

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I agree with most of what you write. Except your analysis of Bryant’s talent.
There were bad turnovers but they had more and still won. It’s the type of turnovers either too lax or forcing drives and shots.
Rose did struggle tonight coaching. Why was Mika in the game that last play. If he was going to be in then have him take the ball out of bounds. Have Rose in position to be a shooter.
Emery’s concentration wasn’t very good tonight.

I don’t fault Bryant’s possible talent, but he appears to be an extremely selfish player who plays without taking the time to look at what’s going on in front of him - head down, here I come - virtually every time. Rose needs to have a serious “team ball” talk with him. The Hoosier coach could take care of this, right?

The rest of the team hogged the ball too. Valpo had a good defense that caused a lot of the one on one. Even with that we still scored 89 points.
We missed some layups and easy shots and they didn’t. Except for the rebounds the stats are very even. We just missed some easy shots.

Bryant is a step slow right now and hasn’t found his shot-plus he is trying to force things to try and get back to where he was. It might be next year before he’s completely back, but Coach Rose needs to manage that situation with Bryant and Emery. I hate to rag too much on Emery because he does a lot of different things well, but he needs to improve his shot selection

I agree with you about Emery, but Haws drives me nuts on the defense side. He like prances between players (don’t know how to desribe it), he moves are slow. He doesn’t show a lot of hustle, atleast Emery seems to be trying. Rose needs to get on him because he obviously has a lot of offensive talent.

This team doesn’t need to jack up 30+ foot 3’s. When they move the ball inside out and around they get 3 point shots at the line and make them.

It’s like Rose said the ball needs to go inside then back out

The Bryant issue is going to be tough. He is a dominating player when healthy. He can score with ease on any BYU player and was totally dominating in practice until he hurt his knee. He has lost his explosiveness, jumping ability, and defensive prowess. He can’t get much elevation on his shot either. Hard to watch. He may need to be sidelined in the training room on rehab for a month. In the meantime, Beo will need to get healthy and be Roses back up. If you run a plus/minus on Emery, you will see the problem. He gives up more points than he scores. Forget the fouls and the refs. Just focus on unforced errors. Emery is the main source of concern. Bryant was a distant second. When you look at defense, Emery also is at the top of the concern list… Followed closely by Davis. Look at the poor shot selection and passing up good shots from other players to take your own questionable shot… Emery leads that category also. Emery can’t stand not being out trying to be the hero. At this point he is not part of a championship team and Coach Rose has better get ahold of the kid before the Frank Jackson comment about living to play with Haws and Mika starts to focus on the name that wasn’t mentioned… And why???

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I agree with your comments because I see the same thing happening out there. I am not as up to speed on the “dominating in practice” aspect of Bryant but I believe it. I know it was only a 3 point loss and blaming it on the refs is sour grapes, especially when they had other issues come into play. Like you say, there were lots of unforced errors, loss of focus and plenty of questionable shots.

If Rose can get Emery to play smart he will be a much better player than he thinks he is right now. It is a maturity thing and I just hope he figures it out. In Emery’s case, he can score 20 and still be a liability. There were so many things wrong with the loss to Valpo yet they only fell 3 points short. It is just that they lost to an inferior team in my opinion.

I just don’t want to see them do the same stuff they did last year… beat GU and SMU, lose 4 or 5 wcc games, finish third and lose a first round ncaa game or go to the NIT. Unfortunately there are signs that lead me to believe the dejavu I am seeing.

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You are spot on Jim. Another issue I believe will haunt this team is the unwillingness of coach Rose to change the rotation based on the assets of the other team. For example, Valpo was a very known quanitity to BYU having lost to them very recently… With Valpo having all the same players back. Davis should not have started and been assigned one of the two big men… Main scorers for Valpo. They are both too quick for him. It should have been readily apparent that Guinn or Aytes or Bryant should have been asked… In that order … To guard the smaller of the bigs. He was left handed and could only get his shots off the dribble and drive. He has no back to the basket game. Quickness guarding him would be far more successful than height. Rose tends to look at his starting lineup strictly from an offensive standpoint. That is a killer. Dean Smith used to change his lineup almost every game. There are many reasons that tactic is good for a team. I think the LP3 termed should be dropped from the BYU vocabulary. We are a new team and frankly I think only 2 of the 3 are going to be top level D-1 players. Rose needs to treat every player equally in terms of expectations and enforcement. Emery needs to be called on the carpet for his continuing poor offensive decisions and sometimes terribly lazy defense… Particularly on help defense. I am starting to call him Nick Carlimery!!

Emery has one bad game and he’s a liability. Please.
Interesting your comments to me says the refs lost that game for us. Now, you are backing what I’ve been saying all along? :thinking:

It will be nice to sandwich our comments around the nonsense of grasshoppers inane words. I don’t remember your posts in the past that well but I agree with a lot of what you are saying because I see that your best interests for the team are there.

Someone needs to be willing to say the things that need to be done. Some of the decisions that are made seem to be at a high school level. The insistence of going with the starters all the time and not using players in an effective way.

There were some bench guys that were very effective in this game early but were not used very much later in the game. I think that was a mistake. The more opportunities that as many players as possible are able to get on the floor early in the season, the more it will pay dividends down the road. Each player needs to find and work on his role in order to help the TEAM be the best it can be.

I’m not backing what you’ve been saying all along, I only agreed with some of your comments. It isn’t an all or nothing situation. There is something of all of it every time. Often times a team plays so well that they win in spite of the refs, sometimes they don’t.

Lastly, do you think Emery had a bad game? He was the leading scorer… and obviously you don’t understand the situation with enough depth to recognize how the leading scorer can still be a liability at times. He is experienced… Mika and Haws are back fresh off missions. Childs is a fresh-man… same with Dastrup. Emery and Davis need to step up and lead with consistency and finding ways to help the TEAM win games. Do you understand that? Emery is a liability when he thinks he is Jimmer.

Whomever this thawk guy is knows what he is talking about. You’d do well to listen to what he is saying with an ear for learning something.

Actually, Emery was 4-8 from 3’s. It was when he would drive the lane where he was 1-8. And there was the lazy inbound pass.
I just don’t know why one game makes someone the worst player of all time. Emery has been a player that when he’s on the bench we lose steam and usually make mistakes. One game. See what happens in the next few games. Same with Bryant.

your opinion of Childs?

I don’t think we need to worry that the wheels are coming off this team just because we had a bad game. Rose is giving Bryant playing time because he knows what a good player we was before the knee surgery. He will help us when he gets back to the form he was before his surgery. The loss to Valpo was frustrating in a lot of ways. Rose will have the players watch the game film and he will point out the areas that need to be addressed. Young teams can get rattled and he will point out that they need to grow and mature so they make better decisions during games. If this team doesn’t bounce back and progress then there is cause for worry. A lot of the frustration was centered around how the refs were calling the game. I think you will see BYU bounce back nicely from this loss.

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Super high upside. Better defender and quicker than Davis. Much better rebounder than Davis. Davis offensive game is a bit more refined. Mika, Child’s, Beo and Haws are on my list of players who can really impact the program in a positive way. Emery and Haws are going to get the playing time as well Davis … Unfortunately! Child’s and Beo should be getting as much time as the LP guys. If Rose ever starts Mika, child’s, Haws, Beo and Rose I would be thrilled.

We can point out all the issues that cost us the game against Valpo, but the bottom line is that you can’t give up 90 plus points and think you should win. When you score 89 points you should win. We have to become relentless on defense. Smartly contest every shot coupled with as few turnovers as you can get by with. Emery is a team turnover killer just like Carlino was. Bryant needs to get his knee 90 percent better to see action because he has Emery tenancies…i don’t know when that will be. Haws needs to have a sit down with coach and come to an agreement to not try difficult passes, don’t shoot 3’s more than 3ft behind the 3pt line and concentrate on defence. Emery would go into a back up role behind Haws and Beo. I think we have been hood winked by the LP3 publicity and they are used to show boating against high school players where they could afford to get away with these antics we are seeing. It is time to hold every player accountable in the areas of defense, TO’s, and poor shot selection. Get on board or lose playing time.

Blah-Beo is an unproven comodity-when he is healthy and proves himself I’ll be the first to jump on the bandwagon. I don’t understand the negativity about LP basketball players-must be some Utah hate thing going on. High school is history-the fact is they were all top 100 recruits whom anyone in their right mind would try and recruit including Jackson who has started the last few games for Duke and is doing great. Emery has a tremendous potential -it’s up to Rose to harness that-if he doesn’t -he isn’t half the coach Few is. Everyone likes to harass the officials-that’s a lost cause and a waste of time-you have to win despite the officiating and to do that you have to play smart and keep your emotions in check. Gonzaga wins because they have talent and Few demands they play smart. When interviewed at half against Florida and down he was so disgusted he almost spit. They fixed what was wrong and came out and won and it wasn’t because of some conspiracy theory or paid off refs-they just played better basketball. So in the end Rose needs to fix what’s wrong and players need to play smarter and more unselfishly and they will win most of their games-end of story