What does that have to do with the profits BYU is making even with fewer fans? They have their deals with ESPN and BYUTV. College is different than the pros and the pros still make huge profits for the owners. The thing with Crowton was different.
Fewer fans means that when ESPN broadcast games, it shows up on the screen⌠Do you really think that is good PR for ESPN?
As much as you like to dismiss the idea, Boosters donations are the driving force for sports. It is how LES was expanded, how the training facilities were upgraded, etcâŚ
Booster club (Cougar Club) has a lot of sway in decisions. Yes, ESPN contract is nice, but it ends in a year of soâŚ
Most of the profits from a game comes from the concession stands, fewer fans means less revenue for the event.
Simple economics Scott.
As for Crowton being different, not really, Do you know why Norm Chow was never put in as HC after Lavell, even though he was told he was going to be the HC after Lavell retired? It was the backlash from the boosters who helped pay for the stadium upgrades, Norm was not known as a people person and he basically pissed off a lot of boosters.
Jim, you are 100% wrong to be blunt
. lumping in sports with Video games is just superficial hyperbolae. Most kids, especially those from broken homes will tell you that a coach stepped in and got them on the right course in life. Most coaches are great mentors to kids.
Many of my friends in life, I met in sports.
Many kids, because of being student athletes were able to get degrees and get professions because of their scholarships in sports.
It was their only means of rising above their broken homes, sucky lives and dangerous communities
Jim, you seem to think that the gospel will solve everything in life, it sounds to be like a person who has not traveled much and seen the many cultures in the world and all the checks and balances the religions, communities and cultures bring to the table to raise a family and to protect against the stupidities of youth and the evils of the world
Chris,
I will come to Jimâs defense for his comments, while I donât agree with him 100 percent, I also donât agree with you 100 percent.
You both bring valid points to the discussion.
Over my 20+ years of officiating, I have seen what you are talking about, Coaches stepping in and helping a young man or woman achieve a better life by helping them focus in sports to keep them away from going down the wrong path.
On the other hand, I have also seen good athletes who had potential to go to college, be destroyed by an over zealous coach who was only interested in âWinningâ.
To Jimâs point, many of these good coaches and friends you speak of, also helps these kids focus on âwhat mattersâ: getting an education, making good choices, looking at obstacles as a way to improve instead of letting it beat you.
In my opinion, the truth of the discussion is somewhere between both your pointsâŚ
I donât think so. I stand by my comment that we live in a society and culture that is overly obsessed with sports. I grew up playing every sport as a kid. I wanted to go to BYU basketball camp but never made it there. That was the extent of it. Of course I dreamed of playing in the nba but I didnât spend my life chasing a dream that would never come about. I didnât spend scads of money playing for a club team or travelling team. My parents didnât hire professional coaches to personally improve my game either. I was taught differently and raised to have balance in my life and living the gospel was a priority.
Yeah, itâs called the plan of salvation, Heavenly Fatherâs eternal plan of happiness for his children. In case there was some confusion, that includes every single one of us, regardless of where we live, what religion we are a part of, what color we are, what gender you identify as⌠blah, blah, blah so yeah, the gospel WILL solve lifeâs problems or everything, whatever you want to call it.
Maybe there was some misunderstanding here. I try to be clear about what I am saying but I can understand some confusion occasionally. I will say it again, regardless of the FACT that sports can be a great help to some of us, it is not deserving of the obsessive focus it has become in our society and culture.
I feel you Jim. We agree on most things but I just see sports as a way to keep young men away from alcohol and drugs and a way to teach young men respect and discipline. I certainly would not throw sports in with the video game addictions.
I think sports is a very healthy way of life to play and to watch, especially in college.
Donât think you and Jim are in conflict with your statements.
I donât think Jim disagrees with the values sports can have. But, with all the social media, more people are consumed with sports. That includes women. As with most things bring compulsive can be bad and destructive. But, so can too much video gaming. Kids today are not very healthy. They donât do enough exercise and that is bad too.
After that lost to USU Bronco M. fired his DC coach and took over from there. BM knows his Defense Stuff! I was surprise we lost to NM some 2 or 3 times and not knowing who was Bronco M. coaching DC for NM. I was glad he came to BYU.
I think Roy is seeing our discussion more clearly than the two of us are Chris. We agree more than we disagree here. The more we discussed it, I think it clarified everything. Itâs all good.
All people who disagree have to do is walk long enough and talk long enough together and everything will be fixed.
IMO there is too much focus on sports in todayâs society. But, the sports and extra curricular activities of middle and High school sports ⌠even college athletics have a huge positive influence on young people. There are countless studies that show that kids involved in extra activities like sports are better students and stay active in life and learn to prioritize in life. The benefits far out way the negatives. The church recognizes this.
But the obsession and not keeping and well rounded perspective is always a risk!
There are risks in life. I think itâs a good thing to give kids the opportunities you stated. Some wonât take advantage of those opportunities. But, itâs worth the risk.
Exactly what I was trying to explain to FISH. I think he understands where I was coming from but it helps to hear someone else say it as well.
Ya, one that explains without conspiracy theories 
Sports are very beneficial, no doubt about it. The problem is that they take up too much time and intrude on family time too much today, compared to when we grew up. Few play multiple sports (which I think is even healthier than specializing), high schools require âclub ballâ and year-round specialization. Sports is way more expensive for families than we were growing up. Itâs nuts.
Sandlot and pick-up games are a thing of the past; all youth sports are organized by and supervised by adults (at high cost). This is part of the decline in the value of sports for youth and people â things were better when people just played.
My wifeâs sister was all-MWC in softball for the U (she wanted to go to BYU, but BYU has a better program and could be more selective. She was told to transfer to BYU from a Juco, but the U offered her a full scholarship as a freshman, so it was a no-brainer). After graduating in accounting, she became the head coach at Southern Utah for a few years. She has now thrown the baby out with the bath water, and declares emphatically that her kids are not playing any sports (she has a two year-old and is expecting their second). She is burned out by the whole sports process, and hates it. She played massive year-round club ball in junior high and high school and missed church and youth activities, and fell away from the Church at Utah (massive drinking and lesbian culture. She was one of the few straight girls, but she went wayward for a while before getting her life on track and is now fully active in the Church).
Very jaded and cynical about the youth sports industrial complex, from her own experience. Iâve urged her to encourage her kids to play sports with old-fashioned moderation. She is 6â0" and her husband is a seven-footer. It would be a shame for their kids with good sports genes and builds most of us can only dream of to swear off sports out of hand. 
Totally understand her perspective⌠itâs a bummer she had to go through all of that and end up with a jaded feeling about it all. A bummer but totally understandable.
Hopefully when her kids get old enough to play and enjoy it they will be involved in something. I think taking up individual sports like swimming or running, where you can truly compete against yourself, are good. The team stuff that requires big monetary and time commitments, in my opinion, have ruined it all.
Thanks for sharing this perspective.
Itâs a shame to give up on team sports, but I think for a lot of LDS families, in this day and age, you kind of have to to preserve family time and prevent burnout.
My high school has a mediocre baseball program, due to talent level compared to the rest of our conference/division. The coach is a good guy and a good coach, as far as that goes (he played for ASU, a top program that only has top talent), but he runs the program like that sort of program. Mandatory year-round workouts (including winter). If my sons were to go out, they would be cut out of hand simply because they havenât participated in the year-long pre-season workouts. If you want to play baseball for him, itâs baseball only â football and basketball are out of the question. You have to commit to his baseball program, and his baseball program alone. This is increasingly common at many schools and communities.
I think it actually doesnât lead to excelling, because of burnout and the lone sport becoming âstale.â I think you need an off-season, and you need a break so that you look forward to the season and itâs âfreshâ and exciting. Attempts to produce specializing âsuper athletesâ produces more like my sister-in-law than it does elite athletes in that one sport, I believe.
Itâs just sad to me that increasingly, kids are discouraged from playing on all sorts of teams in all sorts of seasons. And, they donât spontaneously play among themselves in their free time. Theyâve been conditioned for all sports to be organized and run by adults for them.
Down here in Sourthern California, as a kid, weâd play a lot of pick up games at the local elementary schools and occasionally at the high school. We could just walk on and start playing. But now, they are all locked up after school hours and on weekends. There are sometimes places for kids to go but if they want to play they have to get into an organized league.
But, as we say, today players in college and the pros are bigger, stronger and all around quicker and faster. How did that happen?
This is generally true of formal, official fields (baseball, football, indoor gyms, etc.), but sandlot or pickup football and basketball can be played at any number of outdoor parks, driveways, or fields. Baseball can be played, too, in the absence of backstops. Kids today donât seek out their own fun. I remember playing epic football games in high school in Chicago on grass between houses (pretty wide, and backyard or yard fences were rare. We played tackle, too).
-
I detest, and have no interest in, the NBA, NFL, and increasingly, MLB. I know you adore them, but itâs just WWF entertainment. If they called the strike zone in MLB thatâs actually in the rule book (armpits to knees), batting averages would be south of .150. Itâs a dinner plate, now! They donât call traveling, or lane violations, or often, fouls, really.
-
Yes, athletes are faster and stronger than past eras, largely due to weight training and specializing in one sport from an early age. I still prefer the past where athletes played many sports. What makes them âfaster strongerâ also makes them much more injury-prone.
-
The fun of playing sports is getting sucked out by the youth sports industrial complex. Like my sister-in-law, they just get burned out and itâs not fun any more. My wife played varsity softball as a sophomore and won a state championship, but quit after that. It just wasnât fun any more, and what she was expected to do year-round she just wasnât interested in. Her sister went on to play outfield and bat lead-off for the Utes. When she was in high school, I wanted to have her move in with us so we could win the 2A state championship in Arizona (she would have blown everyone away as a pitcher, but it would have hurt her recruiting). She doesnât even want her kids to play any sports, sheâs so jaded and burned out, and her kids are going to be physical specimens. Iâm trying to get her to just help her kids love sports for their own sakes ---- neighborhood and family.