Huge win for BYU!

We did what had to be done. Shoot 36% from 3s. Make at least 12 3s. Low turnovers. Only 7 for the game.

The best part of the win was the way BYU overcame some very mediocre and somewhat biased officiating to secure the win. All of the missed calls went against BYU and there were several. When BYU had only taken 3 foul shots with less than a minute to go that smelled rotten because Baylor had taken more than 20 and several of those were a result of marginal calls.

Honestly it gets old. Remember it is something I only point out when it is obvious, win or lose. BYU has lost games where the game was officiated fairly and objectively. Seeing tonights game proves that they can win even when the game is not called fairly and objectively. It won’t happen most of the time but it will on occasion.

That was the case tonight.

I know what the Hopper will say but am curious to hear what Larimer and fish have to say. If they tell me I’m full of it my perspective will definitely shift.

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As has been taught to you before. Because we shoot more outside shots and don’t go hard to the basket like other teams do, we will get less calls. The important point is to know what the referees are looking for and what they aren’t. It’s not because they are biased. That has to be a known fact to say that. In any event, I am enjoying the game because I’m in the moment as the game is being played. Not trying find bad calls or no calls every time down the court. You folks should see my text messages from the refinator. Lights up like a 100 foot Christmas tree. :slight_smile:

I watch the same game you do, I just see more of what is going on.

It’s okay, simpleton fans don’t see the entire picture, just the parts of it they think they understand.

The win tonight is an anomaly. In other words, BYU does not usually win a game like this. They did enough things right, making outside shots, collecting offensive rebounds and limiting turnovers. Had they had a few more of those, the officiating would have been a difference in Baylors favor for winning the game. When a Baylor player drives to the basket and doesn’t get touched, yet falls to the ground because he makes an off balance layup, that doesn’t warrant a whistle. When a BYU player goes to the basket and literally has his arm grabbed and pulled away from his body and the ball goes out of bounds, that is a foul. Just because the ref doesn’t call it doesn’t change that fact. Baylor baited the refs into more than one call with their phony antics. BYU isn’t given the same benefit. Yes, they don’t drive and flail themselves into getting a whistle, but that is beside the point.

When I see marginal officiating I call it out, win or lose.

Just responding to your nonsensical, simplistic perspective.

It is besides the point. Yes, Johnson was fouled. Refs miss some things in a game. Just like the players do. It’s just not biased. Pope got his point across. That’s his job. Not yours. I saw no flops by Baylor. They were bodied and because they go directly to the basket and rise above the basket, a numb does cause them to fall. And the guy did crack the side of his head on the floor. I question that he was allowed to go back in the game with a possible concussion.

Like I said, You’re not being objective. You hate the refs before each game begins. Like I said, I don’t worry about it. I know how we play and how others play. So, I know how the games will be called and just sit back and enjoy the games. You should try this :rofl:

One of the big keys was Khalifa’s play. Pope said he he is just getting back to normal after being very ill. He hadn’t been playing well since his illness. When a D1 player sits 2 games because of illness they are really sick. He not only missed 2 games but probably didn’t practice for over a week and his game looked off to me until last night.

He played his best overall game I thought. Traore didn’t play much but was good when he played.

Complete nonsense. You only say things like this to somehow believe you are proving a point. It is a devious tactic and honestly, not very effective or ethical.

Here are a couple of first texts by you as the Baylor game began:

I thought they played well enough at Baylor to have a shot at winning but the officials squashed that. Refs owe BYU a few calls this game. We’ll see

Bad start and terrible call by ref on the and 1

Did you see the foul call? Nobody touched him

BYU can win if they get fair and objective officiating

Moving screen

Another bad call. Off Baylor

Then I asked why every team hits their 3s against us, why? Your response:

Because they got the refs on their side

Crap refs

Make up call

Terrible call

Foose wasn’t fouled but that’s how it is all the bad calls they gotta make up for em now

Folks, there’s a bunch more. But that’s how the texts began. Nothing about how good BYU’s defense was and the offense was. Judge for yourself.

Something about Baylor…you may recall the first game at Baylor we had a clearly unqualified official on the court; that official was afraid of and very intimidated by the Baylor crowd. Pope got on that official for several brutal calls, and the lead official immediately stepped in because he also know his co-worker was unqualified. That ref decided to punish Pope and the result was a game straight up stolen from BYU. You may note we have not seen the junior official in question since then.

Just calling that one like I saw it with my own eyes.

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  2. Saunders got big second half minutes and was a major key to the victory. Not only his 6 second half points, but his knee-to-knee D on all comers was flat SHUT DOWN D. In the final moments he also made a critical steal that led to a 3 at the other end, and a beautiful block that stopped Baylor’s momentum.
  3. 20 assists without a single player having multiple TOs.
  4. Outrebounding one of the very best rebounding teams in the country.

Our shooting was not a big deal. We shot under our season % overall, and only one 3 pointer better than our season %. The difference was the BYU man to man D, great game control by Hall and Khalifa, and clutch plays down the stretch, primarily by Saunders and Robinson.

Defense played well. Hall needs to be taught how to slide through a screen. He is always chasing behind his man with the ball. He goes under the screen and his man gets open. Get Ainge to teach him. He’s the best I’ve seen at sliding over the screen.

38% on 35 shots is excellent. That’s what is needed to win games. And great shooting will help slow down Baylor for good defense.

It began that way because that is how the game began. The early officiating was very one sided. Larimer backed me up on this with evidence from the first game with Baylor, so whatever you want to say is your business. I commented on BYU defense and offense so who cares? You are the one that said it was going to be a long night early on. What did you mean? Frankly I don’t care what you meant. That is your business and I won’t make some half weak attempt at trying to disparage you with stuff you texted.

Unfortunately nobody will be texting you during the games from now on. Whatever you think you are trying to do, have fun with that. I would be working on my own self confidence if I were you. I’m totally fine with everything I said because it is all true. If you don’t think everything I said is something that officials do in a game then you are more unaware than I thought.

You really make yourself look silly by taking the time to post all of that nonsense. Hope you enjoyed it!

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You are looking silly. You are reacting the way one would if they only watch the refs. It’s funny how you can say anything about what I think and a term to disparage me while getting your undies all wadded and twisted. You said I was wrong about you focused on the refs. I simply posted a few comments showing I was correct.

I’ve never said refs don’t blow calls or not call fouls when they should. I simply say it’s not a school or religious bias. And, refs look for specific things before they call a foul that BYU just doesn’t do much.

This is why I focus in more on what the teams are actually doing. Defense important and can stimulate the offense. But great offense can also help the defense too as was in the Baylor game. The fouls will come. So, focus on what we can do to overcome them and win. Sheesh!!! Whaaaaa!

There is no way you can know that. I’m not saying it is or isn’t but I have seen, on more than one occasion, an official or a group of officials that are purposeful in their whistles against BYU. Whether that is religious or school bias, I am not going to speculate. All I know is that I have seen it happen more than once so when the officials are not doing a very good job overall and it is apparent they are focused on making calls that are detrimental, overall, to BYU I am going to point it out. I have seen it in other games called against other teams as well.Sometimes there is recognition on the part of the officiating crew and they whistle make up calls because of it. Will you deny that exists? Sometimes they don’t change during the game and they continue to a point where it has affected the outcome.

If you don’t think it exists then you don’t understand people or the human condition very well.

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We’ve gone over this for you. The refs are looking for specific things that BYU just doesn’t do often. We’ve explained it. BYU plays a much greater game of finesse going for layups and even rebounds, except for a couple of players. Same with defense. It’s just not the same. Have no idea why you don’t see it. We just aren’t as quick and get up as well under control as other teams. We miss give me layups and floaters off the backboards and straight in shots more than other teams. Call it talent. Players who get off the ground higher and hit shows more than those who jump a foot lower. Quickness and strength produce different results as well. It’s just not the same on both ends. Not because of bias, religious or otherwise.

Coaches all over the Big 12 are complaining about the reffing this season…the conference has commented more than once…so take a bigger view…and reality may match your expectations a bit closer.

If that is true (which seems to be if you google about it), then that negates Jim’s contention that the officials are biased because “BYU is an easy target” (his words). Officials are just bad this year!

If other schools are complaining that the officials are biased against their schools, maybe they are not biased, just bad officials. Or that the way they are told by the BIG 12 Leadership how to interpret the rules and officiate in a certain way. Which makes te coaches unhappy (this is a big issue in High school sports).

Personally, I think officials do the best they can do. There are really good ones, mediocre ones and some that simply want to collect a check (these should be weeded out). In basketball, 95% of the calls are subjective (meaning it is left up to the official to determine if the rule was broken). Which makes it harder to call. Floor speed is different than viewing from the stands or on TV with replay. in the stands or on TV you have the advantage of “angle” over the official on the floor.

I also believe very strongly that people see what they want to see. Here is an experiment for you guys. In the next BYU game, in the first half, you focus only on the fouls called on one team, then in the second half, focus only on the calls of the other team.

What this will do is give your perspective of patterns of calling fouls by the officials. That might help some of you out understand why they made the call.

Now I am going to be a dead horse:

When I say, “people see what they want to see”, that is not just my perception of other people, it based on scientific facts.

It’s really important to understand we’re not seeing reality, says neuroscientist Patrick Cavanagh, a research professor at Dartmouth College and a senior fellow at Glendon College in Canada. “We’re seeing a story that’s being created for us.”

Most of the time, the story our brains generate matches the real, physical world — but not always. Our brains also unconsciously bend our perception of reality to meet our desires or expectations. And they fill in gaps using our past experiences.

Thus, if we “Think” officials are biased against BYU, then my brain is “seeing what I expected to see”.

All of this can bias us. Visual illusions present clear and interesting challenges for how we live.

“Reality” is constructed by your brain. Here’s what that means, and why it matters. | Wu Tsai Neurosciences Institute (

Excellent information Floyd and mostly spot on. I also think basketball is much harder to call as well because of the small space with 10 people moving around quickly. Also, if someone isn’t willing to grasp the obvious ways players play the game like driving to avoid contact and driving to create contact then you’ll say the game isn’t being called fairly.

There are calls that are missed against BYU usually with the grabbing of jerseys and moving screens. But most of the time BYU doesn’t put themselves in position to get fouls called as much as other teams do.

And when refs are calling every contact then there are 70 free throws being shot and stoppage of the game looking at flagrant fouls. Then the same people complain about calling the game fairly. I’m surprised we have enough refs these days to take the abuse from fans and coaches.