I disrespect every person involved

in this story, especially the mission president. With Kalani’s most recent salary raise and contract extension and this story, they seem like a harbinger of how much the church is changing in going the way of the world. Just business as usual, even in the mission field. The way of the world. The way of the church nowadays?

Of course, there are no ethics / moral lines crossed . . . at all! Right. I continue to think my loyalties need to be re-evaluated, which they are.

I don’t begrudge it, just think it is sad, but think it is important to comment on it.

And I am very happy that the kid is going to Michigan, hope he gets the education he wants, all of it.

Not sure what you are talking about, but if this posts refers to the Harbaugh visiting a missionary on his P-day.

First, the parents contacted the mission president for permission. he told them that they can only do that IF they are not interrupting the work. which they did by doing it on the P-day. and only during the lunch time. Kalani never contacted the kid so not sure he deserves this wrath.

i don’t believe the parents should have done this myself, but i can understand their actions to an extent.

As for Kalani new salary, What is the problem with getting paid for what you are worth? Do you think that he should not got a raise? The church is notorious for under paying people who work for the corporation… Some of the higher management think people should be happy working for less money because this is the Lord’s church(actually said to me in a interview).

Please explain what specifically you are upset about?

Floyd, I spelled it out. But let me add:

Kilani should get and deserves (deserves = what he gets) every penny he can wheedle out of the church. I have no quarrel with Kilani.

So the kid meeting with Harbough does not interrupt the “work?” Really?

Bet you, my kid, on a mission, who is a great carpenter and wants to meet with a potential boss on his P day to interview for a good job post-mission and requests that permission - bet you he gets turned down cold. After all, that would interrupt the “work.” But . . . . . . . . . . perhaps, on the other hand, maybe this becomes commonplace mission behavior heading into the future.

In re-evaluating, I care less and less, even by the day and hour. Just curious about how the church is changing and how I am changing. When it all comes down to brass tacks, let the business good times roll and the psychological excuses roll-on also. Wooohoooooooo! :thinking: :partying_face:


P-day is “time off” for missionaries to wash their clothes, do things with other missionaries and on occasion meet people who want to talk to you. In some missions, movies are allowed and the district will go to them. Other goes on hike, etc.

P-day was created to give missionaries time off to help prevent Burnout.

Maybe you have never served a mission, I did, while I was on my mission, my parents (who are not LDS) came to visit me. I did it on my P-day. No appointments were disrupted or any of the other multiple things missionaries does.

Floyd, I served a mission (the Alaskan Canadian Mission, at the time with headquarters in Vancouver, BC.) On our P days, we would go to a movie, hike, ride bikes, ride horses, and went skilling once. I think those activities are a good deal different than having an ego-driven HC meet with a missionary to seal the deal on a collegiate football career for that missionary after his mission. If you or others cannot or will not see the difference, it is no skin off my nose.

My concern is not for the particular day but for the particular activity. I don’t care what permissions were given. This particular activity could have consequences down the road. Maybe missionary service should be partly about proselytizing and partly about getting ready for blue-collar work or a white-collar career. Could have coaches from different programs meeting with the elders, for some maybe every other P day. And possible other kinds of employers meeting with the missionaries. How about employment training, meeting with university placement folks, how about training for the trades, etc. Maybe taking time off to go to some of these activities. Maybe some training on how to be a good husband and father - that is important also.

There are times when precedent can be a bi__ch. I just think the church is moving towards being more and more of and with the world, not just “in the world.” On the one hand, it concerns me (less and less with time) and on the other hand, I have a “who cares” attitude. The same thing happened 2,000 years ago, moving forward. I certainly have no control over it. I just like to study history and like to comment on current events and what they may mean going forward.

However, I am now done with this.

It is a little weird the way you toss around the “I don’t care about it” but consistently comment on it. The “Church” isn’t BYU or any of its employees and so Sitake isn’t getting any money out of the “Church” but instead he is getting money from the athletic department of BYU. Big difference which you should know about. The Athletic Dept has its own budget and P/L stmt. The jobs in the athletic area and frankly any area of BYU aren’t callings except one. Not every decision, In fact almost no decisions are made by the BOT. They only give direction and advice on critical issues or big picture directives. So when you toss around the actions of BYU as being the church you are wrong. You are also wrong that a mission president is the “church” and that any decision made by a mission president is representing the Church. He isn’t and he doesn’t. Jim Harbaugh asked to come visit the kid. The mission president directed it be done on a P-Day. It wasn’t a job interview directed by the kid. The kid didn’t even request the visit. If a potential employer from a blue or white collar job wanted to come offer a job to an missionary on their P-Day …. To start 6 months down the road when they end their missionary service, I don’t think most mission presidents would keep it from happening. That almost never happens so it is not a big deal.

I fail to see what has you up in arms and painting the church as moving in a direction you don’t want them to. It is as if you have a illogical beef with the Church teachings and look for ways to attempt to justify your feelings. But your reasoning is flawed and your inability to separate the Church and callings from BYU or any other church owned venture is problematic. If head coaches of top 5 programs did these types of visits very often then I am sure that the “Church” would give some direction to mission presidents but until that happens they rely on the judgment of mission presidents who aren’t perfect and don’t always make the correct decisions. But most of them try really hard.

If you are looking for reasons to exit the church and making yourself feel better by pointing out a kid who got visited by a football coach as a reason to leave …… shaky ground. A lot of good publicity in MI and other news media happened because of the visit. Maybe the kid told Jim he would attend MIch if Jim takes the discussions? Probably not …. But a lot of good can come from a good LDS kid in a top football program. As the church grows there will be more and more LDS kids attending other non BYU schools. That isn’t a bad thing.

Give the comments about the church moving away from certain things a break and focus on the real issue you need to deal with.

Yeah, really amazing. People really do complain about the very things they do. But T, keep on mind-reading, I am sure it is good for your soul. You don’t like my posts, good fer youuuuuu

I actually like most of your posts, Arkie. I just would like to see you lose the “church” is falling narrative. The brethren won’t lead us in the wrong direction. Some of them will make mistakes and not use good judgment on occasion because they aren’t perfect. But as the gospel rolls forth and we as members come to understand doctrine better than policy, things will work themselves out. Be more positive and look for the good in the gospel and the church rather than the prevalent world views and wickedness that is growing louder and louder as you correctly point out. It is tough to ignore the world but focusing on positive and constructive things that we can do or say helps others and most importantly ourselves. I look forward to your knowledgeable sports thoughts and I don’t mind you pointing out issues that are hard to deal with and even ironic inconsistencies. I just worry that you take it so far that you impact your ability to be happy and help others. When I hear people blaming the church …… over 60 years …. I see them never really regain happiness in their life. Don’t go there. But do come on here and be with us!

I agree completely with what you say and would echo the same thoughts to Arkie. Focus on the positive and remember that the brethren, specifically our prophet will not lead us in the wrong direction. He is the mouthpiece of the Lord, especially so in the latter days.

However, it would seem that this pervasive situation makes it very difficult to exercise good judgement and follow Christ’s teachings about uplifting the poor, feeding the hungry, etc. but that discussion is in another thread. :laughing:

Me: In a previous post, I wrote: “I just like to study history and like to comment on current events and what they may mean going forward.” A simple statement about my intention with my post. Did you overlook my bolding and italicizing the “may” word. Still do not understand the mind-reading, as far as I know, you have never met me.

The speechifying . . . knock yourself out.

Good for Kalani. I just hope that BYU can cover the contract without hurting the school’s mission. As we all know, BYU will not get the full Big -12 money share until a couple or three years after we get into the Big-12. I am not even sure of when we will have bowl eligibility from the Big-12. I heard a story here in Texas that five schools will not be bowl eligible from the Big-12 until something like 2025 or 2026. I don’t know if that included BYU or who?

Where did you hear or read that. I suppose Oklahoma and Texas won’t be able to play in any bowl games too? That’s a bunch of nonsense. As soon as we are in, we become eligible for a New Years Six bowl and NC as well. Silly rumor.

Officially Official: Big 12 expands with addition of BYU, Cincinnati, Houston, and UCF (vnexplorer.net)

Says BYU is fully vested from day one. Is there info out there to the contrary?

I read in a couple of articles that the first couple of years, BYU would not get all the money. But I am not sure if they meant if BYU came in before the rest of those teams or not. I will see if I can find the article.

I am told that the Sitake contract extension did not bump his pay immediately. But that it goes up double in year 3. However the pay for his assistant coaches basically doubles immediately. Immediate cash was put forth by 4 donors for this year and next year. My source said that BYU is getting their full part of the big 12 pie one year sooner than the other 3 teams because BYU was able to move immediately and the BIG 12 didn’t want to penalize them or take a chance on letting them entertain another offer. The B12 really had BYU at the top of their list and basically they were doing everything to make BYU feel comfortable from the get go. It was BYU’s decision to wait to physically move until the other 3 schools could …. Just to make sure there weren’t hurt feelings and all schools got along. My source says that the other 3 schools totally were in line with BYU getting paid a year early because of their Indy status and no conference affiliation. So it seems that all is good with money in 2023.

The first year all teams are in the conf they are eligible for B12 bowl affiliation. No penalties for revenue generation at all. Payment from the conference back to the new teams is only half though.

I am also told that in the very first phone call to discuss moving that the B12 told Holmoe that they weren’t going to wait for him to bring up Sunday “play” and that every existing school in the B12 had already discussed the issue and it is a non issue …… an understanding and vote was cast unanimously that the league would allow BYU to not play on Sunday and in fact the comment was made that the league is feeling that it will be good for other schools to have a day off. Baseball was the only concern but they will stick to their word for BYU sports being allowed to be off on Sundays. The issue was never even brought up by BYU.

If you don’t mind answering a question, since you seem to have a good source.

In one of the local papers they talked about how BYU was going to get “fully staffed” and that “Other things” were going to be upgraded or done.

Just curious if you know what “Fully staffed” means? As well as what things are trying to trying to upgrade? are they talking about like the facilities or stadium?

I don’t have much information in those areas. I do know that the sheer size of the staff in the big boy schools is bigger than BYU’s. There have been complaints that the “recruiting dept” isn’t a priority and Sitake wants a full time recruiting dept to help his staff stay in contact and follow up on leads. A full time training staff of 5 is needed and a nutrition staff that can customize a plan for each player is wanted. I believe these are parts of the puzzle that Sitake wants to be able to have in place before next season.

The added upgrades to staff are in the neighborhood of 1.1 million annually for non coaches. As for the stadium and other athletic facilities I am not sure there have been any decisions made. Filling in the corners of LES will bring capacity to 82,000. But I think the long term plans are to wait for 6-8 years and expand and do a major rebuild of box seats for revenue. There have been some wild things talked about as possible avenues going forward but mostly talk.

What would you think if BYU and UVU combined for a football team? All games played at BYU and coaches are BYU. Players can attend UVU and graduate there. Honor code while practicing and playing will remain during team activities. Students from both schools will get in and the student section will be enlarged. Just a thought……stadium capacity will have to go up to 80k plus.

Thanks for the info… I was just curious what the other things were when Tom was explaining the contract extension.