New BYU president

Interesting that the new BYU president had as one of his duties in his prior position to oversee the committee for diversity, equity, and inclusion. I find it disappointing that BYU has such a committee. Those sorts of committees are unnecessary and typically cater to left leaning students and tend to be divisive. I think The idea of equity is wholly Marxist in that it strives to attain equal outcomes. Sounds like an anti-Christian idea to me based on the scriptures and words of the prophets of the restored church.

BYU has plenty of ethnic diversity. Who is excluded from anything? Does diversity of thought mean BYU has to handle some secular ideas with equal importance to the truth of the revealed gospel? Does it mean BYU can’t be be truthful about things like Marxism, the trans movement, the BLM organization, etc.

I would reject the idea of equity out of hand. It has no
place at BYU or any other institution of higher education. Equity is not equivalent to equality which means equal opportunity and equal treatment under the law and not equal outcomes.

I happened to disagree with this comment. No offense, What I see instead is the church is finally getting members to stop being so self-centered and thinking that they are the “chosen ones”. I have personally seen members of our faith tell their children that they cannot play with Latino children because of the color of their skin. The father was our Stake President!

I don’t know how many times i have set in Sacrament meeting listening to a RM report on his mission from South America that members say such things as “He has a Mexican accent” in a disparaging way.

Ethnic Diversity does not mean exclusion of a race, What does mean that people like us “White” folks sometime fails to understand or learn about other cultural views of different ethnics (Black, Asian, Latino) background.

Have you ever been invited to a party that you know that you really were not wanted, but someone was trying to polite? Same kind of deal.

This comes from an article in the Church release:
Yet, in my teaching at Brigham Young University in Provo, Utah, I find that students sometimes struggle to reconcile their notions of diversity and unity. For many, these two ideas can feel incompatible. Thankfully, through class activities and discussions, many students come to understand that Christ’s version of unity is about togetherness, not sameness.

The Blessings of Diversity (

Let me ask you a question: Why was there so much press about Elder Gong and Solares being called to the Twelve? “The first Asian to be called to the Twelve” or “First Latino called to the 12”. The ethnicity of a person being called to the 12 should have no bearing on whether the man is called to the 12. But a lot of people made a big deal about it.

Like I said, I am not trying to offend anyone, you are entitled to your viewpoint, and I appreciate that you are willing to stick your thoughts out there for discussion, without trying to create a “contentious debate”. That shows that you are open to other people viewpoints and may or may not consider what they have to say as well. But you will at least hear people thoughts about it.

I don’t find your response offensive at all. I agree
with most of it. I just find it troubling creating a committee with a title that is used at other
Institutions where those committees have nothing to do with uniting people. I agree we should seek unity. Hopefully at BYU the committee helps to
do that. There is no evidence that those committees at other institutions bring about unity. Unfortunately the terms used have been co-opted by groups
whose purposes run counter to Christian principles.

You posed a question why it was such a big deal when Elder Gong and Soares were called. The fact
that their calling created a big stir because of their ethnicity makes my point. There is too much discussion on the topic of race and our differences and not enough on being a part of the family of man with common parentage. That is a gospel principle. What is not a gospel principle is purposely dividing people on the basis of culture and ethnicity for political purposes. Those deceptively titled
committees create division on many campuses.

I think his post was about the difference between equity and equality and nothing on prejudice that you turned to. Aro is 100% correct in his post.
Also, with respect to who is called as an Apostle, they weren’t called because of their race. Who calls Apostles? The Lord does. End of that.

Prejudice will never completely be eliminated prior to the return of the Lord. It’s sad but hate will still be here. Aro simply equates wokeism with building divisions and hate. Look at the school shooting today in Nashville. Who did the shooting? A transvestite full of hatred of a religious school he once went to.

Thank for your opinion, although I think you missed the mark of my post.
With Aro follow-up comment, I think he understood what I was trying to say.

And I also understood. However, Aro is still correct that it’s a mistake to speak about “equity” over “equality.” Equity has been the engine of the woke movement that is destroying our once patriotic nation. A new poll out show’s patriotism over the last 25 years from 70% to 38%. Religious belief and affiliation to new lows. And the work ethics of our young to an unsustainable economy.
The school shooter in Nashville is reported to be a transgendered woman. By all definitions I can find, that’s a male saying he’s a female. All the news outlets are blaming a woman for this when once again it’s a crazy man behind it. Women losing competition events to trans women and now being blamed for school shootings. Equity. When will we start forcing women to cover their faces in public?

I am in complete agreement with Aro. All of the nonsense we are getting from liberal news media and societal trends, etc. is divisive and not inclusive at all. It is interesting how a group can portray something in a way that is completely opposite of what they supposedly want and totally counterproductive.

That is a sign of the times, calling good evil and evil good.

I probably didn’t explain a few things real well in the process of my first post. I have no issue with diversity of culture, diversity of ethnic groups etc. Certainly those things are a reality and we should strive for unity, but the fact is we will all have to become one in purpose in the ultimate Christian culture. There will be no place for diverse political groups in the theocracy that will be in place during the millenial reign of Christ. The DEI committees on college campuses do not unify, nor do they bring about understanding. That is not their purpose. Their purpose is to divide and conquer and bring about a submission to the ideas of those who control those committees. College campuses today, in large part, do not care for diversity of thought. They are centers of indoctrination for the Marxists. The faculties and administrations have been taken over by the Marxists. I hate to see BYU adopt the language of the secular institutions that have gone off the rails. I would guess that BYU sees the purpose of their DEI committee as far different, than say Stanford, or Harvard would, but why adopt the title, and what is the need for a DEI Committee? It seems the school could strive for unity and inclusion without the need for a committee with a woke title. As far as equity is concerned we all know what political progressives mean by equity and it runs counter to gospel principles and the principles that made our nation great. Jefferson said all men were created equal, meaning equal under the law, in the eyes of their creator in terms of equal opportunity. Equity is the same plan that Lucifer put forth in the beginning.

I don’t even have an issue with diversity of thought. I do have an issue of promoting lies in the name of diversity and those who occupy DEI committees on most campuses do not have any interest in diverstity of thought, and you can only be included if you submit to their will.

The committee that came up with the 26 point action plan for BYU used cringey, woke, Marxist language throughout (e.g., “cultural taxation burdens,” BIPOC, etc.). The actual language (at the end of this article) has to be read to be believed.

Here’s my translation of that into normal English, without the bloated woke/academic language:

  1. Create an Office of Diversity.
  2. Create a new position of Vice President of Diversity.
  3. Give these new positions the authority and „teeth“ to do their job.
  4. Develop and implement training programs on diversity, equity, and racism for administrators, faculty and staff, and students.
  5. Change the curriculum for general education, religion, and elective classes to educate about diversity.
  6. Update the current „Aims of a BYU Education“ to reflect these changes.
  7. Promote and implement „Fostering an Enriched Environment“ at the university.
  8. Instruct colleges and departments to change mission statements to reflect these changes.
  9. Establish a permanent committee to advance equity for non-white faculty and students.
  10. Create a new position of vice president of enrollment management, whose emphasis will be recruitment, admission, scholarships, financial aid, retention, and success of non-white students.
  11. Form a committee to assist the vice president in implementing #10.
  12. Develop a plan to increase graduation rates for non-white students.
  13. Recruit and admit more non-white students to BYU.
  14. Perform an independent evaluation of the admissions process – especially weighting – to enable more non-white students to qualify for admissions.
  15. Evaluate the legality and potential legal problems of race-conscious admissions at BYU.
  16. Enable more non-white students to be competitive for prestigious scholarships.
  17. Create new scholarships for non-white students, named after non-white LDS pioneers (e.g., Jane Manning James, Elijah Abel, etc.).
  18. Create more scholarships, in addition to existing need-based scholarships, for students who come from socioeconomically disadvantaged circumstances.
  19. Create a process for students to report racial discrimination on campus.
  20. Create a dedicated, visible space on campus for minority students.
  21. Ensure that the honor code and dress code does not go out of its way to target non-white students.
  22. Recruit, attract, and retain more non-white faculty to BYU.
  23. Assist and incentivize non-white students who want to pursue graduate school.
  24. Attract more non-white PhD. students to present and conduct their research at BYU.
  25. Reduce cultural discomfort for non-white faculty at BYU.
  26. Promote more non-white faculty into senior administrative positions at BYU.

Yeah, it is disturbing. So BYU has adopted the idea of safe spaces for certain groups of students. That hasn’t done much to foster inclusion and unity where it is done on other campuses.

I could be wrong about how I view this but it appears
there is far too much focus on cultural and
racial differences than on shared values, or promoting values we should all share.

Someone is trying to change BYU into the University of Utah. There are those who want the Church out of BYU. So, who is voicing objection to this nonsense? I was Jewish when I came to BYU in 1977. It was all the things I learned about the Godhead and the Church that helped me develop a testimony and covert. Now, people want members to convert to secularism and other religions?

Recommendation number 20 has all the earmarks of the idea of a safe space. I am not sure how that brings about unity.

All the talk of artificially boosting non-white this and that also seems to be an extreme emphasis on race. I can see some need to improve some things but it appears BYU is going overboard on this issue. Racial divisions were improving markedly in pre-Obama America. This focus of race seemed to emerge during his administration and has only become more extreme.

You are spot on! And the mass killings of children continue in the ghettos of big cities. 400+ last year in Chicago alone and not a peep out of Obama or any other Democrat media. But, 3 children shot by a transgender person is the cry to ban guns.

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I don’t know if you read Bongono or not. He links to news articles with a conservative point of view. When you read the MSN homepage about 90% of the articles are slanted liberal,at best, and anti-conservative at worst. On Bongino you can read articles with a conservative point of view. Anyway, to get to the point Bongino posted an article
about an Arizona female politician who
sent out a tweet with a photo of a woman with a handgun in each hand with a caption stating they were coming after transphobes. I wonder if Twitter will ban her. Republicans are calling for her firing in Az. I think she is the Az governor’s press secretary.

Republicans pass laws to protect children from trans groomers and are accused of causing genocide but it is ok to suggest alleged transphobes should be murdered. Of course transphobe means anybody opposed to teaching the trans lifestyle to children, who opposes sex change surgery for minors, or who believes parents should know if their children are being indoctrinated are transphobes. The insanity, and evil, of this movement is breathtaking.

They set us up with making us all be more tolerable of this evil.

I think you are misstating what is wanted. To be more tolerable? Not even close. The ultimate goal is not tolerance. The ultimate goal is acceptance and embracing of anything that goes against God’s plan of happiness (evil). Ultimately that is what the goal is. Get his teachings and tenets out of the education system so we can re-educate according to the way Satan wanted to do things.

The Brethren largely support and approve of the direction and changes at BYU. This doesn’t impact the truth of the Restoration, or that they hold priesthood keys, but I think it is undeniable that many of the Brethren are more liberal than they were a generation or two ago. This is also mirrored by a sharp left turn in the seminaries and institutes, and many families and youth. I mean, the Board of Trustees chose the vice president over diversity and inclusion to be the next president; it’s not like they are blindsided by this.

I could go on and on with examples (this is a real sore spot for me — what BYU and the Church are heading towards). I don’t think Elder Uchtdorf’s 13 donations to the Biden campaign and the Democrats in the Georgia runoff are an outlier (I know he said that an unnamed family member made the donations with his account in his name, using his address, but that seems like “panic lying” to me. Have any of you ever donated to a candidate or campaign? Why would an “unnamed family member” do that, and why would you give extended family members access to your bank account to do things like that?).

I think the decline in the Church, manifested in declines in things like BYU is just part of the prophesied “fulfilling of the times of the Gentiles.” It is prophesied and is part of this phase in the last days, but it’s still sad when it happens and when we’re living in it.

If the changes at BYU mean they are going to become like almost every other University then that is unfortunate. What was great about BYU was that it was different.

I suspect any member of the church who donated to Biden did so as a reaction against Trump not knowing what Biden is. Now that Biden has shown his true colors and is not the moderate people thought he was I would hope no church member would support him. Lots of members have issues with Trump based on his moral behavior and his demeanor. No matter how immoral and disgusting people find Trump to be Biden is no better and his policies are disastrous.

Great discussion all. While it is personally challenging to hear of some of the directional changes I completely trust that the prophets (especially Pres Nelson and then in turn his future successors) are aware and they in turn completely trust the Lord even if they may personally „wince“ and in their mind think „Really Lord? That’s what the answer is?“. I don’t begin to see why this latest makes sense but the Lord plays the long ball and ALWAYS the hard to understand decisions align with furthering Moses 1:39. Doesn’t have to make sense to be right.

Much of what we see is administrative decisions. And, we’ve seen in the past those kinds are not always right. As long as doctrine is followed, we are seeing the signs of the times.