Did the referees cost BYU the Utah game?

Did the referees cost BYU the game last night against Utah?

According to what you have posted in the past many many times, the Officials are never the reason for a loss. To quote you “The players need to adjust their game the way the officials are calling it”

On the other hand, Coach Pope post game comments about the officiating … was classic!

Pope was great! Obviously sarcastic.
So, you gave me my answer and Coach Cleveland today on Sports Nation. But what is your answer? What cost BYU the game?

Please elaborate on why the referees cost BYU the game. I was out of town and didn’t have access to the Pac 12 network and didn’t see the game. I recorded it but I don’t want to go through the misery of watching us lose a game like that. What did Pope say and what did Steve Cleveland say?

As you know, I listen to Greg Wrubel on radio. I hear many times he would make comments about fouls on BYU players. Some time he would say like what is wrong with that. Like he said last night about Dalton Nixon was fouled when he had jump straight up with his arms/hands up high when blocking a shot. The question was that he didn’t say like - was Dalton move forward in a arch position on any part of his body blocking u player? And another time which sound so head scratching early season game against SDSU that I think it was Lee was in perfect postion to grab a rebound next the basket but SD player reach over him from behind and Lee was called foul. How can he be called and not SD?
Yes I can’t say (which I did last night to SG) refs sucks (sorry Floyd). Yes TJ & Barcello were sloppy players “turnovers.” don’t take care of how they handle the ball “dribbling & lazy passing.”

Why do I read from some you guys about this one ref name “BIG NOSE” that he would call many times on BYU for many years in WAC, MWC & now WCC?

You missed my point, by you were only looking at the first word of my comment. Take a look at the entire comment “NOPE!, according to what you have posted in the past many many times, the Officials are never the reason for a loss.”

I was telling GH that he has posted many times that officials can not cause a loss for a team.

Here is my take…
IF (that is a big IF) the official calling the game is consistent and fair with both teams in how he makes the calls (good calls, bad calls, whatever) then NO, the official can not cause a team to loose a game.

Because both teams are under the same problems of dealing with how he is calling the game and needs to adjust to it.

In other words, it all works out in the end because it was “CONSISTENT” calls being made.

Having said that, I believe PAC-12 are basic homers, they will protect their conference teams to determent of the visiting team, which flies in the face of good officiating. These officials are anything but fair and consistent and they openly display that bias in how they manage the game.

Hope that helps you understand my point.

Watch the Post game interviews of Mark Pope and his sarcasm is pretty evident about officials.

I think in the past you and others have said that calls can influence momentum. Does momentum include unforced turnovers? I don’t think it should. And because it shouldn’t that can be corrected.

I posted elsewhere that I thought Utah was doing something on defense that was confusing BYU into making those turnovers and the coaching staff did not pick up on it. Specifically, there were at least 2 points in the game where we gave up 3 or 4 turnovers in a row leading to layups for Utah. So, that meant 12 to 16 points came off those turnovers that ultimately got them even with us to go into overtime. And, if we get shots off on those 6-8 missed opportunities, we could have scored an additional 6-9 points. The referees had nothing to do with that. However, they did affect the overtime fouling out our needed players.
Pope said he would look at the video. He may find something they were doing to confuse us into making bad passes.

I did something like this when coaching high school basketball. We were a 1A school in a tournament with 4A schools. So, we ran what we called Green play and Gold play (school colors) basically, it was our defense that we would occasionally run to confuse the better schools. If the ball went to our left we would jump into man-to-man. When the ball would swing back to our right we would shift into either a 2-3 zone or a 1-3-1 zone. The shifting confused the players and they would literally pass us directly the ball as we would shift. It worked solidly the first half. Finally, they caught on but it was too late. We hung on to the lead and won. However, the next day, the next team had divised a plan for it and beat us. They were really good with 3 pointers. But, it got us one game :slight_smile:

I see your point, thank you. Yes Pac12 refs are homers. But, I am a little confuse. I thought that only apply to college football. And I thought for college basetball referees are one group in the western states that handles all western conferences (pac12, mwc, wac, wcc, etc.).

Floyd should have that answer as he is all knowing and seeing when it comes to this subject

I agree 100% with your overall position that If officiating is consistent, neither team gets to complain. Last night Big Nose was at perhaps his all time best—or worst. His hate for BYU is well known throughout BYU fandom AND BYU athletic department. His bias shows in many ways—notice his understated mannerism when he would make a call on Utah—which he almost never did—compared to his obnoxious histrionic theatrics when he would make a call on BYU. Why the difference? Because he simply enjoys it. He completely turned the tide of the game in the second half, sending Utah to the line maybe 20 times to our very few. Another example: Toolson and Nixon were getting bumped or raked almost every time in the post, and almost never called—meanwhile dam$ near the whole BYU team had 4 or 5 fouls, almost all of them on touches or bumps in the paint. With all that, we win going away if Yoeli could finish, or if our entire team didn’t quit when Yoeli was out and Big Nose gave Nixon a couple cheapies to foul him out. That left us with NO RESISTANCE whatsoever in the paint. Sad thing all around, but Big Nose (I think his name is Greg Nixon) got his wish in this one.

Maybe I’m a little too far out over my skis on this one, but I think not. I’ve seen and heard too many first hand reports about this guy—we all would like to think officials are people of the highest character, but like in any profession, some people let their bias cloud their judgment. There are a few coaches in my coaching career I don’t like, and I likely couldn’t be impartial if I officiated their games. Greg Nixon is no different. I think this guy is the worst example of this I’ve ever seen. And to be a worse official than the infamous Moose Stubing really is saying something!!

Coach Cleveland said you win by controlling what you can. You can’t control the Nose. You can’t control Childs getting cramps. You can control the number of turnovers. And that’s where we “lost” the game. “We” lost the game.

There is no one organization that supplies officials to different conferences. What basically happens is that the official applies to officiate games for the conferences he wants to work. Goes through whatever process the conference has for hiring officials.

Once hired, there is a website for the conferences uses to assign games. The official can block out days he does not want to work for a particular conference, while allowing games to be assigned for another conference.

I have several friends who officiate football and baseball for multiple conferences. That is how they explained it to me. I would be in the category if it were not for my foot reconstructive surgery two years ago. Still dealing with it.

Shouldn’t have had your foot in your mouth chewing on it :joy:

Sorry to hear about hurting it. Was looking to see you on one of your trips to Southern California. What did you do to it? And thanks for the clarification. Do conferences have their favorites? What about independents? Why can’t we ban big nose?

Didn’t see the game, but followed the score. Seems like BYU led the entire game and leading by 3, gave up a 3pointer with 22 seconds left. If this was the case why wouldn’t you shut down the 3 point line and at worst give up a 2 and force Utah to foul or is this a case of lazy defense? Just curious

For some reason, they went to a zone defense that was supposed to do just that. But, I would have put a double team on Jones because he’s a very good 3 point shooter. Make them go inside or even foul them before they shoot.

Was it a wide open shot?

Wide open nothing but net…

When u made that last 3’s, I was wondering why we didn’t foul some one before they make attempt that 3’s. We would have the last possession and more likely to free throw. We should have won that game.
I didn’t want to see OT which I knew we would lose with out Yoeli, Dalton and TJ.