1- Lohner and Harward are certainly imtimadated by the big moment. How many times was Harward wide open for an easy dunk and just passes the ball out, never looked once to score. Lohner shoots all of two times all game and was arm grabbed on his way up for a dunk and the ref calls an out of bounds backboard call on Lohner…crappy reffing and leads to the next point.
2- Get BYU out of the Catholic Rec league. We are never going to get a fair call in any significant game
BYU shoots 5-7 Fts…Gonzaga shoots 18-27 Fts in the same game. REALLY???
We took turns letting Ayayi having wide open looks in the 1st, then both Suggs and Kispert just launch from 3 in the 2nd. Gonzaga made 12 three point shots, our worst defensive game on the perimeter by far. Never ever sag under a screen on a 3 point specialist.
4 Now for some good news- Knell is a star, he will never go pro but he will win BYU a million games. Not just as a 3 point specialist, Knell defends bigger guys well as in Kispert did not score much with Knell on him.
5 BYU looked world beaters for 22 minutes. When Barcello or Harrms were out, we just fell apart. We had the BBall world chewing fingernails for all but the last 4 minutes.
6- George just plays hard, when he figures things out and the game slows down, that dude will dominate. Same for Lohner, 10 rebs, wow. These two are going to be special.
7 Turnovers got a ton better for this game but sure were untimely.
8 Coach Few, Best coach in America. Never flustered, got his guys to act as a machine in the 2nd. Maybe Randy Bennett sat on the bench in the 2ne half, IDK. They disrupted-flustered us in the 2nd and went to work. I would be surprised if they go undefeated, I am a big fan. Their only weakness is they play only 7 guys. If Timme were to get in foul trouble, They could lose.
Verne Harris reffed 6 BYU games this year
All three Zag losses
The loss to Boise State
The first win against Pepperdine
The win against Weber…
hmm. four of the six BYU losses this season…
last year 5-1 in BYU games
Randy Mcall reffed 6 BYU games this season
Both WCC tourney games
Pepperdine’s win
and the BYU beats of Utah and SMC in Moraga
last year 2-2 in BYU games
David Hall only reffed 3 BYU games this year
BYU’s loss in the wcc tourney final
BYU’s 2OT win over Pacific
And BYU over Utah
Last year 2-2 in BYU games
all three are amongst the most experienced and highest rated refs in the West…
I’m venting of course…the aggressor gets the calls. Very one sided game in the 2nd. Not that it would of won BYU the game but very poorly called game. Every time there was stoppage in the game, I watched Suggs work the refs, I watched Few work the refs. Did not see Pope work them, he just coached his butt off. Too bad BYU lost after a brilliant 3/4s of a game.
I hope the committee was paying closer attention than the national press.
My review of them this morning, mostly just regurgitated the AP of course, shows that it was a ho hum Zags won again.
The few that mentioned specific details varied in their perceptions though some did acknowledge it was the closet thing to a loss the Bulldogs had had since the last loss…which was of course against BYU last year Feb.
I think that it was a psych thing in the end.
They expected to lose and when it got down to the end their expectations kicked into place.
It would be nice to meet them one more time this year…Pope’s boys do improve and the Zags barely survived…I doubt they would survive the fourth time…when it counts in the dance…just wishful thinking of course.
Frank Arnold said in a class that I took from him on coaching basketball that John Wooden was the best ventriloquist ever. Arnold said every time a referee would run past him he would badger the referees. He constantly was on them. Pope was talking to them all game long as well. In my opinion, the FBI should be looking into racketeering in the WCC.
With that said, the size discrepancy with their guards (along with their talent) made their pressure defense more difficult to get open shots. They slowed down our offense as well with it. Got us out of sync. 10-15% better shooting in the second half or 5-6 more fouls shots and the game is even to the buzzer. Pope had a real offense for the game. Unlike the Pepperdine game.
just saw Haarms face in the aftermath of the game last night…truly upset…I think this was the first disappointment he has truly had this year.
I don’t expect him to be disappointed in the Dance.
Elite Eight is where he has been before…
Well BYU was outstanding in the first half, Gonzaga was a defensive machine in the 2nd half. Like Chris said, if Haarms or Barcello is out, BYU suffers and particularly defensively. I thought Haarms did outstanding on Timme and was key for most of the game. I thought if was pretty well refereed game. There was a blocking foul against BYU that was a close call in the 2nd half, but overall each half was about equal except the intentional fouls toward games end-that is proportionally as BYU had more fouls called against them in each half, but led handily in the first. Suggs was outstanding the last 4 minutes and BYU was fatigued at the latter stages. Would have been a nice win but not disappointed at all in the effort. BYU looks like a 7 going in and playing well. Wish ABBA and Haarms would come back and I think Haarms would benefit with getting a little bulkier, but I think he’s already said he wouldn’t. I’m sure ABBA would both find teams outside the NBA to play for. Now it’s time to hope for a bracket like Lunardi is predicting
We watched most of the same game. But 27 to 7 foul shots is not even. It was in the first half. But definitely slanted way towards GU in the 2nd half.
Even with that, the fatigue factor was real at the start of the 2nd half. Shots were way off as the legs were gone. The late game on Monday was too much. So, the bottom line is less ticky tack bad calls against BYU and more definitely missed calls on behalf of GU we would not have had to foul at the end and it would have been a 1-2 point game either way.
You are welcome to view the game anyway you desire-I just saw an aggressive Gonzaga team running cuts every time down the floor and taking the ball aggressively to the hoop as opposed to shooting a lot of three point shots and post ups to a 7’3” center that nobody is going to block anyway. Just never saw flagrant calls or no calls. Even Lohners behind the backboard shot, I looked at it 3 times and he simply was too far under the board. Everyone see’s things differently, but even though rooting for the cougars, still didn’t have any complaints. We had an opportunity to win and just didn’t get it done-nothing to complain about
Can you clarify the reasoning behind this comment? Is it intended to make us accept the fact that their experience should keep us from criticizing their performance in the game? I hope not.
I have seen David Hall officiate many of BYU’s games over the years. In general I would say he does a decent job but I will also mention that on more than one occasion I have seen him make blatantly bad calls against BYU… and seen him get in the face of coaches (Rose more than once) and BYU players, as if he thinks he is the supreme referee who can do no wrong. I have never seen him act in that same manner in any non-BYU game he has officiated.
You see… one problem with experienced officials is that they often get arrogant and full of themselves and their supposed mistake free officiating skills, which is impossible. They make mistakes like everyone. David Hall does not like BYU very much, for whatever reason. It is noticeable.
I cannot speak of the arrogance of basketball referees. I do not know any. Neither do I know of a study that studies such…I wouldn’t be surprised to find that your observation re most experienced officials to be true…it is true of most people at some level who achieve the pinnacle of their profession.
Just looking at his record, ie the games he has called involving BYU. I suppose it might be possible, and certainly somewhere the officiators have a log of all calls made by specific officials, but I do not have access to such information.
But over the last 6 years, he has officiated an equal number of BYU wins and losses. Given that in the last 6 years BYU has a record of 135-61, it does appear he has officiated in an inordinate number of BYU losses.
I guess I see it differently. Yes BYU had an opportunity to win but they played their BEST half of basketball and while being up by 12, they were still called for more fouls in that first half. Was there a difference in their play that warranted that? I don’t believe so. The second half runs by Gonzaga were influenced by the lack of calls against them… for anything. The Kispert charge on Barcello was a big call and only helped Gonzaga in their momentum run. That was a charge and an experienced official should have called it that way.
It does warrant mentioning that the BYU women’s team had a victory stolen from them by poor officiating as well. Gonzaga had their opportunity to win the game and they blew the layup. To make a jump ball call when the Gonzaga player was falling to the ground and there was no real tie up was egregious. All it did was give Gonzaga one more opportunity to win the game and they did. Terrible call at the most critical point in the game. So now the darlings are the women’s team as well.
It took a full second before the clock started to run on the women’s final shot. I used to be in charge of watching Nordoff clock keepers as they would do stuff like that when I assisted the Varsity at SB
I don’t know one way or the other but I do know there was 0.6 seconds left and that is not enough time to catch, turn and shoot. That part of the issue is beside the point. The point is that they never should have gotten the ball for a final try. The GU player fell to the floor while trying to secure a rebound and she travelled. That is not in doubt. The whistle blew and a jump ball was inexplicably called. That gave GU possession and one more try at winning the game on a last second shot.
A lot depends on where you sit when viewing things-every time BYU loses, there are the perennial people that want to blame the officials. I’m sure Gonzaga fans thought the officiating was just great while BYU fans thought it sucked. I try and watch what happens and maintain an unbiased opinion. Some plays are just so close that people see it differently. I thought it was a block, but my Son thought it was a charge. People want to throw out numbers and try and verify their point of views. You can have 4 intentional fouls the last 90 seconds, resulting in 8 ft attempts that can really skew the numbers. No matter-officiating is a tough job and I have little doubt that Gonzaga gets a few calls just because they are Gonzaga or more precisely the Michael Jordan rules. My opinion is that Gonzaga won because they were the better defensive team, but BYU made a heck of an effort to end their streak
I think when one team gets 20 more free throws it’s not unbiased. That was a charge plain and simple facts. Some people don’t like facts. That sort of difference in fouls stops momentum as well.
Aside from that, it wasn’t the only reason for the loss. Shooting 28% in the 2nd half was another reason. With both of those BYU was in the game with 2:30 to go in the game. A few less GU free throws or a few more for BYU, and we were being fouled with calls being made, we may have won. Making 4 or 5 more layups we missed in the 2nd half and we may have won.
What isn’t right is when 3 zebras make it clear who they want to win get in the way of the players deciding the game. Just ask the women’s team. 0.6 left means catch and shoot quickly. Not catch, pivot and shoot. And, a full second ticks off before the clock starts.
