How long has Rose lived in Provo now?

because I am just trying to figure out why he can’t seem to get a wcc BYU team to make any strides or progress. I think he is losing his perspective and ability to see what it is that can make his teams successful. The program is mired in mediocrity. I know the blinders he wore with the LP3 was real but that ship has sailed with Mika going pro, Emery leaving the team and Haws not looking like he is improving much at all. So what is the roadblock this time around?

Fish is already talking about next year and how all the players will be back…

Perpetually looking toward next season is a sure sign that a program is mired in mediocrity… so is change needed? I keep hoping that Rose and his ever changing staff can recognize the strengths and weaknesses of the players and team as a whole and do something to make the team better but it just seems to be business as usual. I’m starting to think BYU will never win the wcc.

It is too easy to get caught inside the bubble of Provo, lose touch with the outside world and develop a delusional perspective that lacks innovation and adaptability.

But wait a minute, BYU is officially in 4th place right now or… in a 4 way tie for 4th place.

He was in our first ward after we got married in 1997. So, he’s been in Provo at least that long.

20 years in a bubble can cloud your thinking.

It appears obvious to those who live outside of it.

There are myriad reasons why BYU will never make its’ way out of the rut they perpetually seem to be in.

LOL!!! You are a former referee and elementary school coach. What is it you actually see? Take it from a 10 year high school coach, Rose makes BYU better. He’s added coaches that have given BYU more defense and better team play. Something you don’t see. If you did, you would understand the importance of key players playing with each other 3 to 4 years.
With the changes of assistant coaches it would have been awesome to see this team with Mika and Emery. Mika and Childs with Dastrup and Nixon coming in to sub. And Worthington in too. Sejlass would play less.

Again, what has BYU done since entering the powerful west coast conference that backs up what you are claiming about Rose making BYU better?

Please explain, oh mr. 10 years of coaching experience, what has made BYU better in the last 6 years. Why didn’t the LP3 win a national college basketball championship? How is the team and program better finishing third in a very weak basketball conference?

Nothing factual to back up your claim.

I’ve got no problem talking about next year. I fully expect Byu to challenge for the wcc crown this year. Rose did make changes. It’s cslled hearh ,shroyer
Come on mr. negative

Haha… Mr. Negative.

How about Mr. Reality and I should pass out a check to BYU fans.

Who would like a “reality check”?

Here it is - BYU lost another game that they had control of for most of and should have won. They lost because they can’t keep it together mentally. They lost because they don’t prepare themselves well enough to win. They lost because they have a coaching staff that doesn’t know how to win games like the one Saturday. They lost because they did everything wrong when it came to crunch time, another BYU hallmark. Last year it was Haws trying to be the next Jimmer, this year it is Bryant and Childs battling over that position.

Jimmer was great but it has been a rough go since he left. It has taken 6 years just to get a team that tries to play team ball. I hope they aren’t regressing to the me first thing again… but when a coaching staff encourages it by holding back the potential of players that play team ball and could contribute to the win total… that’s a bummer.

Who says we would be finishing 3rd without Rose? You have a crystal ball or urim and thumims?
Perhaps the WCC isn’t strong after the top 3 teams. But, SM and GU are strong every year whether you want to admit it or not.
We didn’t have the LP3 for 2 or 3 years.
With Childs and Bryant, had we had the 2 missing pieces we win against SM and GU. Perhaps the LP3 got tired of fans berating them and now they are gone. Way to go fans.

Seniors vs. Sophomores.

That last sentence, Bry and Childs battling to be the next Jimmer? Did Caly weed get into your postum? If that were the case, Bry would have taken the last shot in the SMC game. If I am the coach, I’m telling Childs to take every shot inside of 10 feet, no brainer, especially if Landale is guarding Childs. You lost me there, Jim. Rose…er, Shroyer has got Haws finally taking intelligent shots, the ball in the right guys hands (Bry and Childs).

Haws, after the game, said, “I would have Seljaas take that shot 10 out of 10 times, I have that much confidence in him”. I had wondered why Bry did not take the last shot when it appeared that he had the open look. The reason-it was drawn up to go to Seljaas all along.

Hind sight is always 20-20. BYU will improve and if I were SMC or Gonzaga, I would not like to have to face BYU in a WCC tourney away from my gym. BYU is playing “hump” ball right now. (as in “over the hump”)

I have always thought that the WCC is a two invite team. They have pretty much every year that BYU has been in the WCC. Very excited about BYU basketball.

Not when it comes to BYU because what happened Saturday vs. St. Mary’s is something we have seen so many times before… way more than we have seen the opposite. So what is BYU’s record against St. Mary’s in the last 3 years or so now? 1-6 or something? and why would either of those teams be afraid to face BYU in a wcc tourney game? That is when BYU is at its worst, in the wcc tourney. Why would they be afraid to face a team that hasn’t won the wcc tourney since they came into the league? If I were SMC or GU, facing BYU in the tourney, especially in the title game would be something I looked forward to. :smile:

Jim you can’t be too much of a BYU fan-you are too logical😉 Most of us live by hope and what ifs. Gonzaga has been a national power for a while now and recruits really well now. SMC is well coached and has been recruiting from Australia. We will do better when we finally wake up and realize Utah isn’t the hot bed of basketball in the world. When we do recruit outside Utah, it seems that some of our recruits leave. It would be interesting to know if they thought they were being treated equitably. I’m not trying to cause dissension here but asking fair questions. Right now Chatman is tearing it up at BC and I know the law school gig, but is he in law school now? Not giving answers here, but asking fair questions imo

Either you are being straight forward here and asking logical questions or you are encouraging me in my never ending quest to understand why the athletic department and coaches do some of the things they do.

I don’t know, but in trying to figure it out I come across as being negative.

Based on BYU’s historical success, I believe the team should be doing better in the west coast conference. For whatever reason, they just don’t.

I also believe that Chatman and others were chased off by the LP3 debacle, which is still being felt.

I see them as logical questions, but others may not and I don’t really have a problem with that
It’s often difficult to see outside your own backyard. I do know that BYU made a practice of recruiting world wide at one time but not so much in past years. I don’t think anyone can say the LP3 thing turned out the way they thought it would, for a lot of reasons. Most people were saying TJ Haws would be the best of the family-i don’t see that at this time. Definitely not NBA material, again for several reasons. Childs looks like he has the most upside right now, but he probably needs to stick around another year. I think one thing amazing about Bennett was keeping his team intact for 4 years. Not sure Gonzaga expected losing Collins this year which was a sizable loss for them. Everyone wants to say wait till next year, but you don’t know what next year is going to look like, particularly in basketball where you can make a lot of money in Europe or Asia. Imagine BYU next year without Childs and it could happen. Someone like Dastrup will probably be here 4 years, so in my way of thinking-get him ready to play. Just logical things to ponder

agree 100%. But I think BYU has made a big change with the hire of Shroyer, only time will tell

BYU is a unique institution which has standards 180 degrees opposite most other institutions. Either the AAC or the WCC has standards similar to that of BYU’s. Let’s face it, BYU is a top G-5 school. It is not accepted by the P-5 monopoly conferences. We need to accept those facts and live within our own standards. BYU can be a top competor in the AAC or maybe another conference in football, basketball or maybe even volleyball. WE can still compete in Olympic sports in the WCC.

Please list any college outside of the top tier teams like Duke, Kentucky, etc… that does not recruit their own home state talents first?

Every School recruits their own grown talent except for those like a Gonzaga that has a religion aspect to their school.

Do you know why BYU recruits Utah kids first… it is because those kids outside of Utah are not really interested in coming to BYU and that includes the big named LDS kids…

I find it interesting that some of the LP3 that Jim likes to knock on was recruited by Duke and other big named schools, but because they have not produced like Greg Wrubell said (No BYU coach ever said we would make it to sweet 16) they would, does not make them bad…

I believe coaching has a BIG PART in their failure to live up to the hype.

Yes, the LP3 were recruited by top teams in the country. That’s a fact that Jim and others don’t want to accept. Had life been different and Emery’s marriage went well, we still may have seen the LP3 at BYU this year with Bryant and Childs.
Also, when setting up the last shot in regulation, the coaches will hopefully learn to remind Bryant to shoot the layup if Landale is out of position as he was. That was the difference between the loss and the possible win.

What happened with BYU and SM was Bryant was told to pass out to an open man. Sejlass was open. The reason why we didn’t win 62-60 is because Bryant should have been told if he can lay up the ball, do it. He could have. Easily.

Totally agree. As good as Bryant is, I’m sure he probably said that to himself after the missed shot. I would say that if that play was set up earlier in the game he would have taken it. He has to learn that when the game is on the line winners want the ball. They want that last shot. Yoli was gassed and that’s why he didn’t get the ball.