I’ll agree with the coaching part Floyd, but in years past and some of the great players BYU have had -came from outside of the state Utah and some from outside the United States. Yes, NC, Duke, Kentucky all recruit the hot beds of basketball in their area and all across the nation for that matter-even little old Utah. I don’t know how much you follow bb, but in order to be successful as in league championships, BYU has to do a better job of recruiting outside of Utah. Freddette, Ainge, Kite, Cosic, Chatman and a long list. The talent in Utah will not equate to anything other than 3rd place finishes in conferences like the WCC and if that’s satisfactory then so be it. Not even sure this post addressed the issue and in any case, Jim is RIGHT-BYU hung their future on LP3 and a lot of us bought into it.
I do not follow it as closely as FB…
But of the 14 current players on the basketball team…EIGHT of them are from outside of Utah, SIX of them are from within Utah…
So you want to tell me how BYU is not recruiting outside of Utah?
Now you can complain about not recruiting better players overall… But each coach has their own idea of what is best for their system.
The real issue is coaching… I was told that people in Greg Kite camp thought Coach Arnold ruined him. Because Coach Arnold only used him for defense and not develop his offensive skills which he had in High School.
Not saying Coach Rose is not a good coach, just maybe we are seeming the best he can do with his talents…
Fair enough-if Emery hadn’t quit it would have been even at 7 -7 in a relatively small state. Let’s look at two other religious schools in the same conference. SMC-11 either out of state, but mostly out of the country 3 from the huge state of Ca. Gonzaga-13 out of state-1 out of Wa. A larger state than Utah. You could also say that BYU has superior facilities by far than either program, more potential dollars coming into the program. According to you it’s coaching-According to me it’s coaching and short-sighted recruiting and the inability to retain significant recruits. This is a no win argument for either of us. I assume you are from Utah and I’m not, so we may see things differently, but both of us want BYU to excel. Happy New Year
You don’t even know what the term “recruited” means. There are all kinds of levels of “recruiting”. Schools send letters out, some get phone calls too, some get in home visits and some get actual visits from the head coach with a pen and letter in hand. There are all kinds of levels of recruiting. If every team signed every player they “recruited”, every team would have 50+ players on it.
I played baseball with a kid that got letters from Stanford, UCLA and other schools and he never went on to play college baseball… anywhere. But he was “recruited” by those big schools. I know you won’t understand this FACTUAL proof of what I am saying but others will.
I love how you always reduce a BYU loss down to one play or a couple missed free throws that resulted in a BYU loss… without any consideration to the FACT that the opponent also missed some easy shot or some free throws. that could have resulted in a loss as well. Bottom line is that it was a LOSS and no single play resulted in that LOSS. It is an overall lack of execution, mental toughness, coaching decisions, turnovers, missed free throws, missed last second shots and other things that CONTRIBUTE to the loss. Maybe you will get it or maybe you will not, doesn’t matter.
It is such a simplistic and poor analysis and really has no substance at all. The more astute posters and fans here know exactly what I am saying and that is good enough for me.
Owned. You have me convinced. 
There are all kinds of recruiting levels is silly. You have no idea what level was going on to question my statement. The fact is, they were being recruited by top programs.
What SM does makes no difference. What we did with a close game does. One free throw and we win. Bryant flips in a one foot shot instead of passing to Sejlass and we win. It’s that simple. It’s you that complicates things when it’s better and more accurate to KISS.
You can’t be serious…
What the other team does makes no difference?
Nope. Neither the referees either. It’s up to BYU to have more points at the end of the game. Passing the buck isn’t the answer.
I thought it would be easy to support numerous offers from top bball schools, but can hardly find recruiting let alone offers from even P5 schools…
BYU basketball does not have a recruiting problem and anybody who says they do ignores the facts. They have a problem with high level recruits meeting expectations. That may be a coaching problem. Last year there were 6 ESPN top 100 recruits on the roster Mika, Emery, Haws, Childs, Dastrup & L.J. Rose. This year there are 3. I don’t care where those recruits came from. The fact that 4 of last years top 100 came from Utah, and 3 from one high school, is irrelevant. ESPN rated the recruits not some Utah newspapers. I don’t care where the recruits come from but I do care how they perform once they are in the program. I think Rose does a great job getting the recruits he should get. To ignore the top talent in Utah and go after kids he has no chance to get would be poor recruiting. Once Rose gets them it is his job to mold a high level program out of high level talent.
Those are your facts and the way you interpret them. I haven’t seen anyone suggest not recruiting Utah players. And no I don’t believe Rose gets the most out of his players-not even close-and accordingly, if that was true BYU would be winning against teams that had much lower ranked recruiting classes if you are salivating at the ESPN’s ratings which in LP3’s case was over-rated. Mika and Childs lived up to their hype. It’s hard to claim all this great recruiting and getting the most out of your recruits and to be relegated to NIT bids and 3rd place finishes. N0-Gonzaga recruits great and gets the most out of their recruits. You know-that dinky little school in Washington or that high school gym team down in California that everyone says is talent deficient. So when BYU sits atop the all powerful WCC , then i’ll listen to how great your Utah recruits are and how the coach gets so much out of them. Getting a little nauseated by the great Utah athletic egotism, Idaho probably produces better athletes. Sorry I apologize for the rant-not my style, but it gets old
I haven’t seen anybody suggest Rose shouldn’t recruit Utah either but I have seen a number of people suggest he needed to expand beyond recruiting Utah. I think he does recruit beyond Utah but some of the comments I have seen over the last few years imply that Rose is missing out on better players by focusing on Utah recruits. There is no evidence of that. I think people have to be careful what they wish for. You can ignore the guys who are good and want to come and maybe lose a few going after guys out of state you probably won’t get. I think Rose is a good recruiter. The issue is whether he coaches his recruits up to expectations.
You are misinterpreting what I am saying. I didn’t say Rose got the most out of his recruits. I said there was nothing wrong with his recruits and it was up to him to get the most out of them. Go back and read my post again! I don’t live in Utah and your comment about being nauseated over Utah athletic egotism seems to indicate some personal problem of yours with Utah rather than something that is endemic to the people of Utah.
Too many people are all hung up on where the players come from and too many people outside the state of Utah assume that most high rated Utah recruits are overrated. Rose has had plenty of good players from outside the state of Utah. To suggest that there has to be a quota on the number of Utah players as opposed to out of state players is ridiculous. You recruit the best players you have a good shot at getting regardless of where they come from. Period, end of story.
No problem-don’t agree with your assessment of Rose or your recruiting assessment. But it’s a free country and you have the right to your own judgements. Bottom line under your own guidelines BYU continues to underachieve. Thankful they have Heath this year-period-end of story
I am usually on board with aro and I think I understand what he is saying. It is not as bad as I portray it, though I disagree a little with the idea that he does ENOUGH recruiting outside of Utah. I think he needs to do more and then more importantly, I think he needs to actually do something with those recruits when they get to BYU.
I know I harp about Dastrup but he is the perfect example of the problem. Here is a top 100 recruit who actually had offers from big schools and he chose BYU. What has been done with him since he got here? Not much… 6 minutes a game in his second full season?
and Aro… true on the first part because there doesn’t need to be a quota. It’s just that the number is representative of the bigger problem, which is that BYU doesn’t do enough of the second part. They aren’t recruiting much outside or they aren’t getting much outside of Utah. I mean they got Worthington out of Wisconsin so…
So while Sundance probably did misunderstand your comments, I do think he has a point and it relates more to what Rose does with his recruits once they get to BYU. Those top 100 guys aren’t living up to the hype and fans should be asking why, especially when the Dastrups of the team spend way too much time on the bench.
WCC all conference tj, nick, mika,
Yoeli picked preseason all conference…
Dastrup is the only 4 star I can think of who was severely miss-used. (well of the four star kids that is.)
I think the others were much more a case of the team underperforming than the individuals underperforming.
The only thing better really than all conference would be conference PoY or All American. to say that a four star player didn’t make those honors is a bit strong I think…
Mika was fine, Childs is good-Emery has good athletic skills, but the head got in the way maybe. Haws i really have fun watching, but who could have believed he wouldn’t be a defensive liability. Not sure but for supposedly having one of the top recruiting classes in the nation, and then getting Seljass, Childs, and Dastrup-wouldn’t you have expected more? Then you bring in a new assistant coach and the defense and offense improves. The open question is why? Either some of the players were over-rated or they weren’t coached up. I can truthfully say I’ve seen more players leave BYU out of frustration-that had greater bb skills than a couple of high recruits. Let Jim or Tom answer that one. Just a thought😁
You can not do anything with a “All Star” recruit who came back from his mission 40 lbs over weight and totally out of shape.
There are limits even a coach can do…
All last year, Dastrup was running out of gas during the game, he had no stamina… This is all well documented in the Deseret News stories last year.
During the off season, Dastrup worked hard to get back in shape and shed some lbs… He seems to be playing better now, but he still has a long way to go.
Yeah, when you are playing 5 minutes a game, it is a long way to go. At 40 min. per full game and 5 min. average, an entire season is equal to about 3 full games.
Why doesn’t anyone talk about how little Haws or Seljaas or some of these other guys do with their 30+ minutes a game?
They should be doing way more than they are doing with all the minutes they get. Worthington gets lots of minutes every game and he doesn’t do much at all.
If he does not have the stamina, then what is a coach suppose to do?
I specifically targeted Dastrup because you seem to think he is a victim of the LP3. When in fact he was so out of shape and overweight he could only do 5-10 minutes at stretch… that is on the player, not the coach.
As for the others… who would you play Jim…
I targeted Dastrup because it is so clear that he has the skills to be a very good player and make significant contributions but did not get the time and experience he needed earlier in the season. Maybe he felt the effects of the LP3 but I did not mention him as a victim of that debacle. Those victims have moved on… one of them, Jeff Chatman’s kid is doing really well in a conference that makes the wcc look like little league.
Face the facts, BYU wastes the talent they get and they underperform year after year.