You just repeated what I said that not all judgments are immediately done by God. He calls men as Bishops and others to make judgments. The final judgments will be God’s. So, I was correct.
And, possibly in the future, the Lord may require more strict observation of the word of wisdom and those who eat too much meet may have to answer. At that point, I’m not going to argue and demand the Lord change His Commandments to suit my lifestyle. But, this is what the LGBTQ politicians and community are demanding. That was my point. Also, perhaps this will be that great purge issue that is coming. Whose side are we going to be on?
When did the Lord stop expecting us to live the commandments exactly? News to me
Doctrine and Covenants 56:3
Behold, I, the Lord, command; and he that will not shall be cut off in mine own due time, after I have commanded and the commandment is broken.
So, do you live the word of wisdom exactly? Tick-tock tick-tock…
Not sure what you are trying to convey here. Maybe just trolling 
Grasshopper,
Thank you for asking.
Sources: The Holy Bible, King James Version
1 Corinthians 4:5 Therefore do not pronounce judgment before the time, before the Lord comes, who will bring to light the things now hidden in darkness and will disclose the purposes of the heart. Then each one will receive his commendation from God
Romans 14:12-14 S o then each of us will give an account of himself to God.
Therefore let us not pass judgment on one another any longer, but rather decide never to put a stumbling block or hindrance in the way of a brother.
I know and am persuaded in the Lord Jesus that nothing is unclean in itself, but it is unclean for anyone who thinks it unclean.
Romans 14:1-4 *As for the one who is weak in faith, welcome him, but not to quarrel over opinions. One person believes he may eat anything, while the weak person eats only vegetables.
Let not the one who eats despise the one who abstains, and let not the one who abstains pass judgment on the one who eats, for God has welcomed him.
Who are you to pass judgment on the servant of another? It is before his own master that he stands or falls. And he will be upheld, for the Lord is able to make him stand.*
Matthew 7:2-4 *For with the judgment you pronounce you will be judged, and with the measure you use it will be measured to you.
Why do you see the speck that is in your brother’s eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye?
How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of* your eye ,’ when there is the log in your own eye?
Psalms 75:6-7 For not from the east or from the west and not from the wilderness comes lifting up,
but it is God who executes judgment, putting down one and lifting up another.
John 5:21-3 1 For as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, so also the Son gives life to whom he will.
The Father judges no one, but has given (A L L) judgment to the Son, that all may honor the Son, just as they honor the Father.
Deuteronomy 1:13-18
You shall not be intimidated by anyone,
for the judgment is God’s.
And the case that is too hard for you, you shall bring to me, and I will hear it.’ And I commanded you at that time all the things that you should do. (the words of Moses)
Matthew 7:2-4 For with the judgment you pronounce you will be judged, and with the measure you use it will be measured to you. Why do you see the speck that is in your brother’s eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye? Or how can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye ,’ when there is the log in your own eye?
There are many more Grasshopper. Would you like more references, or do you have an open mind and are you capable of change? (Could all of this from each of these sources all be misinterpreted?
grasshopper,
It is obvious that you see yourself as a better person than Floyd. You question if he lives the Word of Wisdom as it is apparent that you do.
It is obvious that you are a return missionary and that you are totally loyal and committed to your life time teachings and that you have learned those teachings well.
It is clear from many of your past postings that you can just about tell which each and everyone of our weaknesses are and where we should improve.
If you could find one fault in yourself, what do you believe that one fault might be, if any ?
SOMETIMES FLOYD,
Things that we are taught to be in the Word of Wisdom, we learn decades later, that indeed, it was never in the word of Wisdom, but instead, just somebodies opinion. (Coke). etc.
What we need is to have in writing, from a General Authority, a statement:
This is Gospel and is a part of the Word of Wisdom
Vs.
This is only opinion and not gospel
List the different two groups of common beliefs, be they Gospel or opinion.
John 7:24, “Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgments. There are many latter day scriptures as well as more in the New Testament. Seems like we have to use our God given brains to put together that which seems to contradict when there is none.
We all must daily make judgments to follow the lead of others or not. How we do this makes the difference. Sometimes we have to warn others of their foolishness behavior and actions. Without our good people stepping up and taking stands against evil, evil would easily win. So, to me, it gets back to the “double-minded” person as James speaks of. Not that we judge. But that we judge righteously meaning not as the hypocrites do.
grasshopper,
What I think that you are saying, correct me if I misunderstand, we only believe the Bible in the places that it agrees with the D&C. Is that correct?
Back to the honor code:
I see nothing wrong with having rules that benefit the majority of the people so long as it does not harm the minority of the people.
Having a living Standard which we would like all of our students to abide by is one thing. I see nothing in the Bible that suggest that we should not strive for high standards.
I think that high standards for some people of one culture, may not particularly be a high standard for someone of a different culture.
Should we only serve those that are from a culture like ours, or should we be open to all of God’s Creation?
Should we find fault in a person’s culture different than our own, or Therefore let us not pass judgment on one another any longer, but rather decide never to put a stumbling block or hindrance in the way of a brother.
Should we point out to our students where they are wrong, or
do we pay attention to the Bible Matthew 5:21-3
How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of* your eye ,’ when there is the log in your own eye?
Should we tell the LGBTQ community students, that they are an
abomination in the site of the Lord, or do we learn anything from
Romans 14:1-4 I know and am persuaded in the Lord Jesus
that nothing is unclean in itself, but it is unclean for anyone who
thinks it unclean.
Should we publicly shame a person or punish a person that had
a drink, or should we learn from Romans 14: 1-4
Let not the one who eats despise the one who abstains, and let not the one who abstains pass judgment on the one who eats,
for God has welcomed him. Who are you to pass judgment on the servant of another? It is before his own master that he stands or falls. And he will be upheld, for the Lord is able to make him stand.*
Matthew 7:2-4 *For with the judgment you pronounce you will be
judged, and with the measure you use it will be measured to you.
Why do you see the speck that is in your brother’s eye, but do
not notice the log that is in your own eye?
How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of* your eye ,’ when there is the log in your own eye?
You took several quotes from the same book. That’s actually only one testament. Add another testament like the D&C or Book of Mormon you have the witness of two or more. I agree that I am not the one who will pronounce the final judgment for anyone. But, I recognize that the Lord is clear that we should be prepared to teach doctrine. Not to condemn but to instruct and correct when we see evil. Stand to defend the Kingdom of God as we have so covenanted to do. This isn’t a Church where the Doctrines and Commandments are decided by a majority vote. Safety in numbers means nothing. I like that the Church owned BYU wants the students and employees to be learning what the Doctrines and Commandments are and challenged to live them.
I find this whole thread amusing to say the least…
I understand both sides of the issue, and I happened to lean toward what Ronald is saying more than Scott.
Scott provides some valid points, but there is one thing that he seems to be missing in this points, The “Who”!. Is it our responsible for correcting people or is it left to those who have the proper authority to judge. Are we the ones to “teach the doctrines” of repentance (Which is really what is being discussed here)? or is there another avenue available?
I found this quote by President Monson
"There is really no way we can know the heart, the intentions, or the circumstances of someone who might say or do something we find reason to criticize. Thus the commandment: “Judge not.”
https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/general-conference/2010/10/charity-never-faileth?lang=eng&query=charity+never+faileth
Personally (we all have to decide where the line is) I will never judge someone else for the choices they make or how they live their lives. As President Monson said “I do not know the whole story”.
I was once told by an Apostle while serving on my mission (it was in a Zone meeting) that it was not my job to judge other people or their actions, but to live my life in such a way that it would radiate the love of the gospel I had and would invite others to ask me about my lifestyle (I am paraphrasing here, but the point is made).
I prefer to do the living the gospel way rather than trying to be the one “teaching doctrines” to those that are not living the gospel in my viewpoint.
Each of us make our own decision, that is what moral agency is about.
Not judging others is a difficult concept to put into practice, but one that ultimately leads one to peace and acceptance of our place in this sometimes cruel and frustrating world. Most of us can do little to change the outcomes, but as long as we live the kind of life Christ taught us, we can live in the eye of the hurricane. Driving the interstate may be a good example-we can do so with anger and frustration or we can calmly stay on the path, knowing we will eventually reach our destination safe and secure. Ron always has a lot of good thoughts, even though he can be overly ponderous 
I understand what you are doing. You are living a safe and good life taking no risk to invite others to learn about the Gospel. Just sit back and wait for someone to open their mouths and ask for help. I don’t think that is what we are being asked to do. And, the scriptures concerning warning our neighbors isn’t for only the bishops, Stake Presidents or GAs. We are supposed to warn each other.
Yes, you can’t know what is in the heart of another. But you can still see the path a person is taking will lead to paradise or hell and either congratulate or warn them of their path. Because if you don’t, then who? So, how do you warn without judging them and telling them what they are doing will lead to destruction? I first try to use logic and reason with them so they come to the understanding. I’m sure you tried that a lot with your kids and grandkids. But, eventually there will be some things they continue to resist you and get into trouble anyways. And you then have to warn them what they are doing is wrong. But, it sounds like you don’t and sit back and watch them fall? Really? Warning doesn’t imply making a final judgment. Maybe it does to those who can’t warn without judging yourself to be better than others.
So, here is a question. How do you love a sinner? By approving of the evil they are participating in? So, the sinners can point at you and say, “See, Aaron approves and made a golden calf.” How do you love a sinner and not support the evil they participate in? I say it there are always ways to show love by helping them turn from their sins. They first have to know they are sinning. But, you won’t tell them. You will wait to find this out. You will let other Christians tell them and help them first and then step in afterwards to get them to celestial glory. You will let others get into the fight for souls until they can see your level of righteousness. How good you have it. Is that your mode of operation? Did I get that right? Correct me if I’m wrong?
“NO”, You don’t…
I live a life as the Savior teaches, Help people with Love and Kindness, not Judgement and criticisms.
You love the person, regardless of their actions. I have a daughter who is not living the way she has been taught. I do not like the decisions she made and she knows that, but above all else, she knows that I love her and she is important part of my life. I never once lectured her on the decisions she made, I accept the moral agency she has and try to live a life that one day will help her return to the path.
What I know with an absolute certainty is that if you lecture or criticize or condemn a person for their choices that do not meet your standards or expectations, that person will NEVER come back into the fold and you will loose any type of relationship you had. I have seen it in my own family as well as several people I know.
I have seen it so many times in our church where parents do as you said only too damage their relationship beyond repair.
So Scott, Here is what I do:
- I live a life that reflects the importance of the gospel in my life (Let my light shine)
- I develop my relationship so that the person I am around feels comfortable with talking to me about issues they are having.
- If someone asks me my opinion on choices they made, or important decisions they need to make, I always council with them and give them my honest unfiltered opinion on the subject. But at the end of the day it is still their decision to make, I tell them I will always love them no matter what decision they make. because THAT IS WHAT THE SAVIOR HAS TOLD US TO DO!
As I said before, I prefer to use charity towards my fellow man, and not get so caught up in the “Letter of the Law” and how I should dictate to someone else how to live their lives.
Sounds similar to my life as well. And the steps you take are similar to what I also do. But, when someone is going to drive off a cliff, I’m going to do what I can to stop them. I’m not going to wait around all pious. But, I’m not going to support their sins either. I’m not going to be a grand Marshall in a Gay Pride parade.
Thank you Floyd.
Too often, when we think that we are living the word of the law, we forget the spirit of the law.
When we set ourselves up as the authority, I believe that we loose much of that authority which we may have had before we abused it.
It could be argued one way or another about what the Bible says about “Nothing shall be added or taken away from this Book” But I think that we jeopardize our own beliefs when we put so little importance on what the Bible says when compared to the D&C, Pearl of Great Price, and B of M. I think we need to be very careful, lest we bring the wrath of the entire Christian World, outside of Mormonism, against us. Already religions i.e. Calvary Chapel call us an evil Cult of the Devil.
Ron
Grasshopper,
I will never be as good and as pure as you think that you are.
I like your thinking and your understanding of the Gospel Floyd. Thank you again.
Again, I understand, that much of what I post, you do not agree with, however, you are intelligent enough to disagree in an acceptable manner, which is by not setting yourself up as judge and jury and by not being a (know it all). Thank you for the way that you sometimes disagree with my position. I respect your opinions and the way you express them.
McConkie once said the Bible is the blueprint for the Church. That meant the structure for the Church like based upon Apostles and Prophets, Teachers, Priests… Therefore, we are lead by our present day Prophet. The D&C is for us in the Latter Days to follow as far as structure and any new commandments such as the covenants and commandments given in the Temple. The New and Everlasting Covenant of Marriage. The Book of Mormon is for the convincing of Jew and Gentile that Our Father lives, Jesus is the Christ and the Holy Ghost will bear witness to this. The Pearl of Great Price gives us more understanding of the Plan of Salvation and the History of the World. All is for the edifying of the Saints.
Many give the Bible too much distinction and say we have no need for more communication between God and man. Yet, many of those people reject much in the Bible such as the structure of a Church of Christ. And, they reject the commandments when it doesn’t suit their life choices and lifestyle.
Did you notice that BYU is changing the way they handle the Honor Code Violation as a result of all the protest against “How” BYU administered the Honor Code?
This is clear evidence that even the church (not the gospel) can make mistakes in how they do things. BYU and BOT clearly saw some flaws in how the honor code is administered, so they “improved” the process.
Scott, most of the protest was not about changing the Honor Code itself, it was to change the process of how it is administered. Apparently, the Brethren agreed with the protesters and not with your point of view 